Drones Assembled Options

[Grim Tuesday]

Lets be honest, the person who designed them .... made something really weird.

Here is the result:

All drones are very weak to SmallArms and Gattling type of damage.
All drones need power to operate.

So far so good. I would point out that making all units coming from one building weak to two very easy strategies is something very unique among all other factions, but I guess it is intended.

Now look closer:

What is one of the strength of USA which gives it unique feeling like horde bonus for china? Well - pilots. I have not seen many players using this feature to its full potential, because it requires even more micro in battle and to adopt your play style around them.
And guess what? Drones are going straight against this concept.

Secondly, whats should be the power spike upgrade on Tier 1? For example China gets 25% ROF for all ground units which is pretty significant. USA has one much more trickier and that is the double XP upgrade.
Again, drones do not benefit from that. Its true that drones have their own upgrade, which makes some of them even cost effective for their price (for example GD can go toe to toe with battlemaster), but right now you are wasting the potential of having new pilots for your late game.

Lastly they do not benefit from battle plans (nor damage nor HP nor range), which is again another upgrade comparable to ERA etc.


As you see they are going right against the concept of USA.
When you now return to the firsts two points, you see that drones even double your weakness against enemy, because USA is intended to be weak against AA/AI and has electricity problems.

This post has been edited by Grim Tuesday: 1 Sep 2015, 21:33

[__CrUsHeR]

The drones are a "breaking the rules" concept within the USA doctrine (and all other ROTR doctrines); this is not necessarily a problem, but it's something I've tried to point out before in one of my approaches about drones: - the drones are not worth investing in long games because they do not receive upgrades necessary to be effective as with the other T0/T1 units of the other factions. But apparently this is not the vision of the most players.

This post has been edited by __CrUsHeR: 1 Sep 2015, 18:08

[XAttus]

Guardians are meh...
Sentries are the best stealth detectors in the game after upgrade, as well as powerful anti infantry and LV units.
Repair drones are okay, they do what they are supposed to.
Termites are rarely used but can be annoying and even gamechanging when used well.
AT drones are meh...
Mules are useful but still underused.

Well ye right now the drones are not viable on their own (unless you are a crazy guy and you somehow manage to stay alive with them, blame is on the opponent in that case) but they are a great way to complement your human piloted army.

There are some flaws in the concept such as their intended weakness vs bullet based weapons when in fact they are supposed to provide protection vs T0 AA rushing but the reply on that was that the whole dronage will get redesigned at some point to better suit their intended purpose.

[Grim Tuesday]

Guardians are meh...
Sentries are the best stealth detectors in the game after upgrade, as well as powerful anti infantry and LV units.
Repair drones are okay, they do what they are supposed to.
Termites are rarely used but can be annoying and even gamechanging when used well.
AT drones are meh...
Mules are useful but still underused.

Well ye right now the drones are not viable on their own (unless you are a crazy guy and you somehow manage to stay alive with them, blame is on the opponent in that case) but they are a great way to complement your human piloted army.

There are some flaws in the concept such as their intended weakness vs bullet based weapons when in fact they are supposed to provide protection vs T0 AA rushing but the reply on that was that the whole dronage will get redesigned at some point to better suit their intended purpose.

Thats nice to know.
I agree with you on your points.

Right now drones cant be used in any way but support as explained above.

This thread is more about pointing out the issues than complaining about being OP/UP.

This post has been edited by Grim Tuesday: 1 Sep 2015, 19:58

[Mizo]

I don't really understand why they dont benefit from battle plans

[Shiro]

Drones aren't human, they execute plans just as they are programmed... something like that, I think.

[XAttus]

Drones aren't human, they execute plans just as they are programmed... something like that, I think.

Interesting to see the leaning towards realism in this case when in general the game is far from it. In my opinion it was just intended that way and that's a good explanation to feed those who ask why...

Anyway, this is also another case of those redundancies that will be sorted out for 2.0, no need to brainstorm about how to make drones useful.

[The_Hunter]

Realism isn't an important factor in our design intentions no but its also not something that's completely ignored either.

With drones this is an intended feature in the same way how they don't get promotion and are completely unaffected by biological and chemical weapons.

[M.P]

Are HKs included?

[{Lads}RikerZZZ]

Well ye right now the drones are not viable on their own (unless you are a crazy guy and you somehow manage to stay alive with them, blame is on the opponent in that case) but they are a great way to complement your human piloted army.

Well apparently I'm that crazy guy that actually uses Guardians.
Anyway, my 2 cents:
1) Guardians: all they need is a cost reduction and a t2 effect from the drone upgrade.
2) Sentries. 100% good don't need changes... Although I wouldn't mind if they were a tad cheaper
3) Termites just need to move faster to be more viable.
4) AT drones need their burrow ability remove, and re-designed to something useful. I have never used, or seen the burrow effectively mainly because it takes far too much time to spread the drones out and the burrow them. Not to mention that they have to be right under where the enemy army is coming from, in which case its more feasible to just put termites there.
What they need is an ability that allows them to get up close and personal with their target quickly.
Perhaps something like a giant leap where they fly into the air and are untargetable until they hit the ground again.
5) Mules. eh they have their job I guess.

Are HKs included?

No. They are an air unit.

[8igDaddy8lake]

Well apparently I'm that crazy guy that actually uses Guardians.
Anyway, my 2 cents:
1) Guardians: all they need is a cost reduction and a t2 effect from the drone upgrade.
2) Sentries. 100% good don't need changes... Although I wouldn't mind if they were a tad cheaper
3) Termites just need to move faster to be more viable.
4) AT drones need their burrow ability remove, and re-designed to something useful. I have never used, or seen the burrow effectively mainly because it takes far too much time to spread the drones out and the burrow them. Not to mention that they have to be right under where the enemy army is coming from, in which case its more feasible to just put termites there.
What they need is an ability that allows them to get up close and personal with their target quickly.
Perhaps something like a giant leap where they fly into the air and are untargetable until they hit the ground again.
5) Mules. eh they have their job I guess.

No. They are an air unit.

Starting to get into suggestion territory, but...

I feel like AT Drones would be scarier if they had stealth (or even temporary stealth) on ASA Upgrade, which is removed when they attack. It would make them VERY annoying, but still weak to a lot of things (such as massed Conscripts, Gattling with Troop Crawler support, Guard Towers, Partisans).

[LoneRebel]

Yeah, I see the issue here. Drones counteract three of the USA's special and unique gameplay features - they don't have pilots to eject from them, they don't gain veterancy in the first place (and therefore don't benefit from Advanced Training), and they apparently don't benefit from the Strategy Center's strategies either? It does seem a little odd to have an entire class of units that so strongly goes against its faction's unique features. But of course drones shouldn't have pilots, that's the whole point of them. Same goes for not gaining veterancy - though I suppose you could argue that drones should gain veterancy if they have "learning processing computers" (as Arnold would put it). And I actually thought drones benefited from battle plans this whole time.

The Drone Upgrades and immunity to toxins and radiation are pretty big buffs, and partly compensate for the aforementioned weaknesses - but not entirely IMO. I'm interested to see how drones will be reworked for 2.0.

[Baneblade]

Allright so I'm everything but a regular USA player, but one thing that disturbs me about USA is the following.

Sentries are the only USA stalth detection unit if I'm not mistaken (if not this post has no point at all). So if you want to be able to fence off a hero unit attack (or need early stealth detection for some reason), you need an early enough drone assembly depot just for that purpose. Now even if you don't like drones, the DAD takes power in your base, has slowed down your teching up, and is not free, so you will be tempted to put it to some use, allthemore if you have to face attacks from your opponent and need extra units to defend/counter-attack. So in most cases, you'll be compelled to use those drones even though you did not intend it at the beginning.

So a non-drone stealth detection unit in USA arsenal would solve part of the issue IMHO.

[Knjaz.]

Allright so I'm everything but a regular USA player, but one thing that disturbs me about USA is the following.

Sentries are the only USA stalth detection unit if I'm not mistaken.

You are. There're 2 more.

Vanguard recon drone ability (anti-garrison infantry that requires Drone Plant to be built), and Predator Drones (or whatever thier name is, the regulat Recon Drones from your CC) after Software upgrade. The latter ones act as stealthed Tier 2 stealth detection, then, when you deply them.

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 10 Sep 2015, 9:27

[{Lads}RikerZZZ]

Actually on to topic of the vanguard stealth drone, why is it on cool down when the vanguard is built? Coding thing, or is it a balance thing?

[Damfoos]

and Predator Drones (or whatever thier name is, the regulat Recon Drones from your CC) after Software upgrade

Isn't this upgrade available only after building the Assembly plant?

[Shiro]

Isn't this upgrade available only after building the Assembly plant?

Advanced Drone Warfare only requires the Strategy Center it is researched in, it does not require the Drone Assembly or anything. In fact no upgrade can be set to be "not researchable" when a specific structure or unit is missing.

[vectorguy]

Vanguard recon drone ability

Doesn't this have to be deployed manually though and it crashes after a set time?

[Grim Tuesday]

Doesn't this have to be deployed manually though and it crashes after a set time?

Yes

[{Lads}RikerZZZ]

Doesn't this have to be deployed manually though and it crashes after a set time?

Yes, but they last for a while and if you have a bunch of them and mash 'X' you can stealth detect huge areas of the map. Its handy for finding command trucks lol

[Baneblade]

You are. There're 2 more.

Vanguard recon drone ability (anti-garrison infantry that requires Drone Plant to be built), and Predator Drones (or whatever thier name is, the regulat Recon Drones from your CC) after Software upgrade. The latter ones act as stealthed Tier 2 stealth detection, then, when you deply them.

Thank you Kinjaz it is very helpful, actually I had not yet found out how to activate this "special power" onto Predator Drones (though I suspected there should be something with drone upgrades), and also didn't notice recon drones did detect stealth.

Nonetheless back to my point, you still have to integrate early Drone Assembly Depot into your build order if you need stealth detection before T2 and Strat Center, which makes USA the only faction that requires a non-tech building for early stealth detection. After that, when I play versus USA, I must admit I've never been in a hurry to see those T2 nighthawks hovering near my base (provided I can see them).