Rise of the Reds Update: It Came from Outer Space Options

[Serialkillerwhal...]

To be fair, I believe the whole cold fusion thing was already stated in an earlier update to have been clever marketing rather than real tech.

Link? And more importantly, they made a ractor cappable of matching a nuclear one of slightly larger size, potentially triplle it's power with new tech and is completely clean, not leaving nuclear waste.

[aeroth]

Ok I see again people hit EU with 0 facts.

Well the most advanced research in matter of fusion on the planet atm is....surprise in europe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITER

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_European_Torus

and as a bonus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_Hadron_Collider


Feel free to use the google to check the facts.

@arsenal thank you for the simple explanation my dislexia allways makes me to write some stupid complicated thing about a simple matter.

Now I have some questions for MARS
How the satelite incident is gonna affect the relations between us and eca ?? I mean they did shoot each other
And if the spetsnaz are the ones that were responsible for this event then not only aleksandr is the bad dude. Seems like the spetsnaz are also playing dirty. Maybe Orlov has some dark side on him ?

This post has been edited by aeroth: 1 Nov 2012, 13:59

[Serialkillerwhal...]

That was 30 years ago,

In other words, with the accelration of technology, two centuries.

[Lobo Solitario]

Link? And more importantly, they made a ractor cappable of matching a nuclear one of slightly larger size, potentially triplle it's power with new tech and is completely clean, not leaving nuclear waste.

http://forums.swr-productions.com/index.php?showtopic=3629

Halfway through the opening post:

"I get that question quite often. You see, without wishing any offence to the American colleagues, the system that they created is not exactly 'cold fusion' as most people would imagine it from sci-fi shows. That was one of those catchy PR terms that the folks at National Atomics decided to throw in there for marketing purposes. Every American scientist worth his salt cringes at the use of that term just as much as we do. No, what they basically did was build a much smaller 'doughnut' that runs on the most basic hot fusion reaction, at the lowest possible temperature and pressure, that is sustained by a regular nuclear fission reactor. Those so-called field generators that entered service with the US military decades ago are actually just feed stations containing a truck-sized replaceable battery that is merely charged by one of these reactors safely behind the frontlines, but I guess the idea that this is actual cold fusion just caught on, kind of like that whole 'god particle' thing..."

[wargame10]

@serial

and why you still whiteknighting?!

cant accept that ECA has awesome superweapon?!


sucks to be you man

This post has been edited by wargame: 1 Nov 2012, 14:11

[MARS]

Now I have some questions for MARS
How the satelite incident is gonna affect the relations between us and eca ?? I mean they did shoot each other
And if the spetsnaz are the ones that were responsible for this event then not only aleksandr is the bad dude. Seems like the spetsnaz are also playing dirty. Maybe Orlov has some dark side on him ?

They did shoot at each other, but it appears as if the US government still went easier on the Euros than the Russians in this matter. Page three mentions the possibility of a 'future rapprochement', suggesting that the US have a long-term strategy of wanting to get back on the good side of the ECA. As such, their government took serious symbolical offence to this incident, but decided to cover things up rather than lashing out at the ECA beyond a few harsh words. As for the Spetsnaz, we should all keep in mind that they're still elite black ops commandos, and even though Orlov has so far been characterised as a good and honest soldier, he also has a history of being one of these operators, meaning that he may not be evil or amoral - unlike Aleksandr - but still able to get his hands dirty if necessary. The Spetsnaz are known for their brutality, which really comes with the trade of being a special forces unit. One shouldn't buy into the illusion that the secret stuff done by SEALs, SAS etc. is 'clean' by comparison. It's called wet-work for a reason.

[aeroth]

@serial

and why you still whiteknighting?!

cant accept that ECA has awesome superweapon?!


sucks to be you man

If I tell him that the biggest economy on the planet is EU he'll have a hearth attack.

[DELETED MEMBER]

the ECA still needed 15 years more when the Americans were already using they PC on the field through

[aeroth]

The Spetsnaz are known for their brutality, which really comes with the trade of being a special forces unit. One shouldn't buy into the illusion that the secret stuff done by SEALs, SAS etc. is 'clean' by comparison. It's called wet-work for a reason.

Nice. Then we will get some more storyline about the spetsnaz ? Or some more spetsnaz action behind the scene in the future ? What about U.S. or China or ECA black ops ?

[MARS]

In reference to Kirasama's post:
Exactly. The US already -had- practical Particle Cannons and these 'not-quite-cold fusion' plants during the war against the GLA i.e. by 2020 while the in-universe EU went down the gutter and suffered another financial meltdown due to the global economic tremors caused by the GLA attacks on China. We learn nothing about their military capabilities beyond the startling implication that some of their forces where deployed against their own people before the GLA attacked them in 2028.

[Guest_Vintorez_*]

Yes indeed.


Also very noteworthy. The Solaris sports the shortest cooldown of all super weapons ; 4 minute timer.

That is the same timer as the Particle Cannon right?

[__CrUsHeR]

OFF TOPIC

They forget that cold fusion ... the truth is that the Soviets were many years ahead of Western countries in energy technologies and they dominated the nuclear fusion, read about the Tokamak Reactor, there is no fiction in it. Pure suspension plasma as a second sun on the earth.

BACK TO THE TOPIC

Now I remembered the plasma technology, some time ago I saw some drawings by Comr4de for the ROTR soldiers with plasma weapons, any chance of seeing these guys or this technology with the Russians in the future?

[Anubis]

It's funny how everybody today thinks that the french were a bunch of cowards. They did win actually allot of wars like the 100 years war and were a dominant power of the world.

Is there needed I say the name of Napoleon Bonaparte ? The man that saved the french from internal warfare and war with all the major european powers and transformed France in a power that defeatead all europe. Only the russian winter changed the couse of history

You know, just because people make jokes, doesn't mean they are ignorant retards.

So given all this background story with usa and the other vanilla factions, will the campaign have missions that also make use of either of the 3 old factions ?

This post has been edited by Anubis: 1 Nov 2012, 14:39

[The_Hunter]

will the campaign have missions that also make use of either of the 3 old factions ?

All of them will be featured in one way or an other but not as playable armies as it's obviously all about russians and europeans.

[Anubis]

All of them will be featured in one way or an other but not as playable armies as it's obviously all about russians and europeans.

I meant, make use of some of their units or stuff ( maybe even similar to the act of war mercenaries ), not as fully playable in the missions.

[Nemanja]

In addition to these short, concentrated bursts, European commanders can also experiment with a longer, broader solar saturation to turn entire areas into cooking wastelands for extended periods.

Wait . . .This firing mode from the video is short, concentrated burst or longer, broader solar saturation ?

[aeroth]

I meant, make use of some of their units or stuff ( maybe even similar to the act of war mercenaries ), not as fully playable in the missions.

I never tryied to imply anything I was only making conversation. I apologize if you found the reply offensive, it really was not my intention.

Imi cer iertare

[SpiralSpectre]

They did shoot at each other, but it appears as if the US government still went easier on the Euros than the Russians in this matter. Page three mentions the possibility of a 'future rapprochement', suggesting that the US have a long-term strategy of wanting to get back on the good side of the ECA. As such, their government took serious symbolical offence to this incident, but decided to cover things up rather than lashing out at the ECA beyond a few harsh words. As for the Spetsnaz, we should all keep in mind that they're still elite black ops commandos, and even though Orlov has so far been characterised as a good and honest soldier, he also has a history of being one of these operators, meaning that he may not be evil or amoral - unlike Aleksandr - but still able to get his hands dirty if necessary. The Spetsnaz are known for their brutality, which really comes with the trade of being a special forces unit. One shouldn't buy into the illusion that the secret stuff done by SEALs, SAS etc. is 'clean' by comparison. It's called wet-work for a reason.

The way I see it, Orlov somehow managed to keep his personal and professional life apart. Or more like he squeezed his feelings in a little cage and trap it somewhere in his head, but he didn't kill them off. When he has command and control he prefers to remain honest and good as long as possible. But he wouldn't necessarily back away from doing something questionable when ordered by higher command or for the sake of a mission... he is a Spetsnaz after all.

And this process has indeed taken a toll on his mind. He has lost ties with cultural and social norms, like already said before all those shady black ops mission took away his faith in religion and stuff. Some might say he has lost a part of his soul. But in the end the "good" person in him isn't dead and that's a HUGE achievement for any black op member.

[MARS]

Orlov's attitude towards his job can be compared to that of a butcher. It's a dirty, uncomfortable job devoid of honour or glory, but -someone- has to do it, so it might as well be an honest chap like him who still knows the limits of his work rather than some utterly ruthless individual like Aleksandr. Shock Troopers on the other hand; their humanity has been demolished and reduced to nothing beyond a.) hatred and b.) a passion for violence. Orlov by comparison comes off as relatively sympathetic; despite all the shit that he's seen and done, he does care for the well-being of his men (as such, he doesn't treat them like throw-away chess pieces) and he knows the reality of warfare.

[aeroth]

would orlov kill civilians ? What are his limits ?

[MARS]

Realistically speaking, spec ops would probably do that if the civies posed a severe risk that could compromise their mission, but flat-out indiscriminate massacres would obviously be beyond that. For one, a spec ops operator has too much of a career to lose. Unless he goes literally insane, he wouldn't risk all that to blow off some aggression. That's more something a lowly rank-and-file grunt frustrated by tiresome patrol duty and an ungrateful populace would do. Orlov certainly wouldn't execute orders to literally go out and murder everyone. Aleks would have to send his Shock Troopers for that kinda thing.

[SpiralSpectre]

Orlov's attitude towards his job can be compared to that of a butcher. It's a dirty, uncomfortable job devoid of honour or glory, but -someone- has to do it, so it might as well be an honest chap like him who still knows the limits of his work rather than some utterly ruthless individual like Aleksandr. Shock Troopers on the other hand; their humanity has been demolished and reduced to nothing beyond a.) hatred and b.) a passion for violence. Orlov by comparison comes off as relatively sympathetic; despite all the shit that he's seen and done, he does care for the well-being of his men (as such, he doesn't treat them like throw-away chess pieces) and he knows the reality of warfare.

Guess so. From what we see from his MTG, he probably didn't have any clues about the realities of warfare or the true duties some soldiers have to carry out. He signed in to serve motherland and with the years he found himself in an uncomfortable yet somewhat powerful position.

Alek is a totally odd one. His passion for violence is unmatched yet he can be quite manipulative and undoubtedly is a genius. He is a funny mix... remids of classical evil geniuses we see in different media.

would orlov kill civilians ? What are his limits ?

From what we've seen so far, it's safe to say he would never do that. More like none of the Russian commanders minus Alek would do that.

edit - ninjaed.

This post has been edited by SpiralSpectre: 1 Nov 2012, 15:49

[Cobretti]

Now that's a great update. The Solaris cannon looks even better than I expected!

BTW is there any chance that the Euros somehow used copies of Russian made weapons/bullets to get Russians involved while Spetsnaz weren't actually present at that time? Did Ruskies really manage to down that satellite without anyone knowing beforehand... if so then how? Always thought US was safest in these global conflicts thanks to their geographic position, guess that doesn't provide that much safety anymore. Now what will be their policies knowing they got violated? How safe is geographically more vulnerable China if US can't protect their water surrounded fortress? Questions, questions... a lot keep popping up... great update!

This was more a commando raid than an all out invasion, which would be pretty difficult to do on the US for geographic and military/logistical reasons.

As for your question, the ECA's use of solar energy is merely a sensible solution to the future energy crisis. They had a lot of money to spend thanks to the Chinese credits which allowed them to pursue a number of expensive but ultimately lucrative development projects whereas the Americans never received that kind of bonus and had to implement their less sophisticated fusion technologies completely out of their own economic power, but earlier. However, there is no 'cultish' dimension to this: The Euros haven't turned into pagan sun worshippers all of a sudden; they merely use the sun because it's the most practical thing they can do.

Something like that. I'd assumed that the US used its own home-grown fusion power to replace fossil fuel power plants. It's likely fairly expensive to implement and works well enough to not have a replacement for it. Later on, the Europeans used the fusion concept plus some additional research and made a more advanced version of it.

Precisely - the US is likely in a position where it has had to balance budgets and offset research expenses against socially painful cuts, and probably a fairly static society due to economic difficulties, all of which make it a lot harder for them to take risks or get funding for new research. Europe on the other hand is flush with Chinese money, probably experiencing high growth and social mobility, and freed from a lot of its constraints because things like social security probably went out with the collapse and are only now starting to slowly come back - giving it a lot of cash and few restrictions on how to spend it, a great environment to do revolutionary research in.

By this time, the US has made a strong economic recovery and is more or less back to where it was before the GLA war militarily. However, the Chinese cash did undoubtedly help with the R&D of the Solaris program.

[aeroth]

Realistically speaking, spec ops would probably do that if the civies posed a severe risk that could compromise their mission, but flat-out indiscriminate massacres would obviously be beyond that. For one, a spec ops operator has too much of a career to lose. Unless he goes literally insane, he wouldn't risk all that to blow off some aggression. That's more something a lowly rank-and-file grunt frustrated by tiresome patrol duty and an ungrateful populace would do. Orlov certainly wouldn't execute orders to literally go out and murder everyone. Aleks would have to send his Shock Troopers for that kinda thing.

What about China generals they all kinda have a grim comunist auroa around them ? How do you faire the chinesse general on the moral scale of ROTR ?

[MARS]

Difficult. For one, previous updates have established that they seem to be more mindful of their international image (credits for Europe, ban on neutron weapons) as well as the liberalisations mentioned in the Generals story, but on the other hand, their leadership appears to be deceptive and manipulative, the country is still a capital P single Party state and if their in-game tactics are any indication, they don't even pay much regard to the safety of their own soldiers. Obviously, we aren't going to include scenes of cruelty for the mere sake of having them - they need to serve some purpose within the narrative, otherwise they carry no real weight. As for their Generals, Chen's combat experience has apparently numbed him to the point where he too is perfectly capable of expending troops en masse, Jin is described as staunch, unforgiving and petty while Mau is more interested in fancy fireworks and army management than the actual fighting.