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Russia and the project of future tank (5th Generation)
re_simeone
post 5 May 2015, 12:50
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Tbh that tank looks to me like one of Iranian tank mock ups they show on their parades.
As for new BMP,it looks pretty nice,I am talking just about looks.
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__CrUsHeR
post 5 May 2015, 14:48
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QUOTE (re_simeone @ 5 May 2015, 8:50) *
Tbh that tank looks to me like one of Iranian tank mock ups they show on their parades.
As for new BMP,it looks pretty nice,I am talking just about looks.

The Russia does not need to show mockups in parades. tongue.gif

If it is a mockup is being prepared almost two decades. wink.gif


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The_Hunter
post 5 May 2015, 19:06
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QUOTE (Svea Rike @ 5 May 2015, 13:23) *
Even though I said it was sexy are we really criticizing how a tank looks? You know these things are designed to kill, right? The turret is probably designed that way because it provides some unknown advantage over their usual rounded design.
My brain does have more computing power than that of a potato so yes i understand that the technical parts of it are likely to be quite alright but doesn't mean i have to like the visual aspects of the vehicle.
Most modern/new generation vehicle designs tend to look downright awful


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Svea Rike
post 5 May 2015, 20:01
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And this looked pretty?



Preferences, preferences. I do hope the T-14 does not have to face combat any time soon, but as we all know in a couple of years or decades it surely will.


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Knjaz.
post 6 May 2015, 17:41
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Well, people are coming to general consensus that actual turret armor layout is much closer to this thing, (that surfaced rather long time ago), than to the outer shape of Armata turret.


Or this concept



Somebody even tried to photoshop it on T14 platform.




This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 6 May 2015, 17:55
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__CrUsHeR
post 6 May 2015, 18:00
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^ I would say that the version with the extended tower (extra armor and external ammunition capsule) can be controlled remotely, but usually must be manned, as in conventional tanks of previous generation.

Also it is discussed the possibility of the tower not be finished and software are being on development for the 100% unmanned tower, it is a possibility since the project is expensive and must be suffering budget cuts, (but it's all is speculation).

This post has been edited by __CrUsHeR: 6 May 2015, 18:15


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Serialkillerwhal...
post 7 May 2015, 1:51
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It has to be angular because angular works better with modern armor, something about the particulars of composite armor or something. Can't quite remember. Round turrets went the way of the rifled cannon, a seemingly good idea at first that the modern arms race somehow turns into a inferior product.

This post has been edited by Serialkillerwhale: 7 May 2015, 1:55


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__CrUsHeR
post 7 May 2015, 18:32
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Other interesting facts disclosed about the T-15:

Will be able as well as the T-80U and T-90 series of fire through the 125mm cannon ATGM projectiles Sokol-1 (I don't find much information on this system that apparently is 'top secret'), which hypothetically makes the difference of Russian's technology for battles between tanks.

The travel speed on paved roads should be 75 km/h (which is not new/innovative).

The government and the Russian media defend the idea that this tank will be the first in the world to be manned 100% remotely in the near future, which of course is doubtful but not impossible.


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Serialkillerwhal...
post 9 May 2015, 11:19
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If it were manned remotely, design it for that. The damn thing is designed with a 3 man crew in mind, and has room for 3 squishies in it. A future remote tank would be smaller while keeping the same performance because it didn't have to keep 3 people, air filters, tea warmers, and chairs in there.

TLDR: Sounds like horseshit or bad designing.


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__CrUsHeR
post 9 May 2015, 12:42
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QUOTE (Serialkillerwhale @ 9 May 2015, 7:19) *
If it were manned remotely, design it for that. The damn thing is designed with a 3 man crew in mind, and has room for 3 squishies in it. A future remote tank would be smaller while keeping the same performance because it didn't have to keep 3 people, air filters, tea warmers, and chairs in there.

TLDR: Sounds like horseshit or bad designing.

I believe there will be no in the next 50 years a tank that is 100% automated, unable to support a crew, because an exclusively standalone automated version is not interessente to any country since everyone wants to be allowed to control the vehicle with a crew on board; this involves reducing costs, ability to operate the vehicle after any technical problems related to complex software and the ability to export the vehicle to countries that do not have sufucientes technical resources to operate a vehicle 100% automated; therefore the possibility of remote control of the vehicle is something additional and complementary that even should not be a standard configuration of the Armata.


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__CrUsHeR
post 14 May 2015, 12:57
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Another novelty about the Armata: Russian Next-Generation Armata Tank to Receive Bigger Gun

After decades will be one of the first MBTs to receive a 152mm cannon; the expectation about the development of this tank is constantly increasing; if all this is confirmed it will be a unique vehicle.

Another demonstration of muscles by Russia. 8chi.png


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Serialkillerwhal...
post 14 May 2015, 13:55
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Picture related.


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__CrUsHeR
post 14 May 2015, 17:17
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To get an idea of what should be coming to the Armata I recommend this video: New Russian Uran military robots 2015 test новый русский боевые роботы

These robots are the Uran family and are fully controlled by remote control; note that these large vehicles are designed for extinguish fires, rescue and etc; they will appear in the Army 2015 exhibition.

These same robots can be equipped with support arms and are conducting maneuvers tests in Russia; this should be the future of Armata tank and other vehicles to come; Russia is preparing rapidly for a non-conventional war scenario.


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Pepo
post 14 May 2015, 21:57
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QUOTE (__CrUsHeR @ 14 May 2015, 13:57) *
Another novelty about the Armata: Russian Next-Generation Armata Tank to Receive Bigger Gun

After decades will be one of the first MBTs to receive a 152mm cannon; the expectation about the development of this tank is constantly increasing; if all this is confirmed it will be a unique vehicle.

Another demonstration of muscles by Russia. 8chi.png

The Americans designed the CATTB, a 140 mm armed Abrams and if I remember correctly Switzerland modified a Leo 2 to carry a 140mm. I don't think this bigger guns offer a great advantage: they take more time to reload and are expensier. Also the main tank killer today is the missile not the gun. I feel that it is a bit of a waste of resources

As for the Armata tank, it is an innovation but it is expensive. Russia might commit the same error of the USSR again: expending too much on weapons rather than to focus that money on the economy. I doubt that the T-14 is the tank Russia needs now. Rather than focus in new , shining tanks when Russia already have A lot of tanks is a waste money. Improving their economic base is not( also the air force need more money than the army in Russia)
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__CrUsHeR
post 14 May 2015, 22:13
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QUOTE (Pepo @ 14 May 2015, 17:57) *
The Americans designed the CATTB, a 140 mm armed Abrams and if I remember correctly Switzerland modified a Leo 2 to carry a 140mm. I don't think this bigger guns offer a great advantage: they take more time to reload and are expensier. Also the main tank killer today is the missile not the gun. I feel that it is a bit of a waste of resources

Specific ammunition must be produced for the new caliber, but in fact the cannons of 125mm are the best so far.
QUOTE (Pepo @ 14 May 2015, 17:57) *
As for the Armata tank, it is an innovation but it is expensive. Russia might commit the same error of the USSR again: expending too much on weapons rather than to focus that money on the economy. I doubt that the T-14 is the tank Russia needs now. Rather than focus in new , shining tanks when Russia already have A lot of tanks is a waste money. Improving their economic base is not( also the air force need more money than the army in Russia)

The Russian economy is based on commodities and energy, due to the current geopolitical scenario makes necessary the rapid modernization and restructuring of military means to ensure the flow of this market, vital to Russia.

In fact the Russian Air Force needs modernization, but still is fully operational. In addition to developing new fighters they are already being prepared for the modernizetion of Tu-22M and Tu-95.


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Pepo
post 15 May 2015, 15:21
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QUOTE (__CrUsHeR @ 14 May 2015, 23:13) *
The Russian economy is based on commodities and energy, due to the current geopolitical scenario makes necessary the rapid modernization and restructuring of military means to ensure the flow of this market, vital to Russia.

In fact the Russian Air Force needs modernization, but still is fully operational. In addition to developing new fighters they are already being prepared for the modernizetion of Tu-22M and Tu-95.

I didn't say that they shouldn't design new weapons, in fact they should, but they aren't going to get any benefit by getting 2000 tanks. With 500 off then it would be enough. The armata isn't cheap, and it is much more expensier than a tipical soviet design. Russia is heading the same way as the USSR: expending too much on weapons rather than in their population the only difference being that the USSR was stronger.

And the air force need a lot more of figther's and scrap the tu-95( Us should done the same with the b-52)Russia air force need the money that Putin is expending on tanks . if a country lacks air control, it would lose any conventional war. And no, SAM aren't a way to get air superiority either
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__CrUsHeR
post 15 May 2015, 15:59
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QUOTE (Pepo @ 15 May 2015, 11:21) *
I didn't say that they shouldn't design new weapons, in fact they should, but they aren't going to get any benefit by getting 2000 tanks. With 500 off then it would be enough. The armata isn't cheap, and it is much more expensier than a tipical soviet design. Russia is heading the same way as the USSR: expending too much on weapons rather than in their population the only difference being that the USSR was stronger.

Surely Russia did not order the poduction of 2000 Armatas in the near future, we must assume that in fact was a government bluff; Russia would not have financial conditions and how well you said and the need for an order of this size.
QUOTE (Pepo @ 15 May 2015, 11:21) *
And the air force need a lot more of figther's and scrap the tu-95( Us should done the same with the b-52)Russia air force need the money that Putin is expending on tanks . if a country lacks air control, it would lose any conventional war. And no, SAM aren't a way to get air superiority either

The VVS is one of the largest air forces in the world with 160,000 men and powerful fighters for every type of mission (at the regional and global scale), powered by an autonomous aviation industry; It might be better structured than the land and naval forces.

The bombers like the B-52 and Tu-95 hardly cease to exist because they are 'weapons of depth' aimed at intercontinental missions; and above that affect the psychological factor of an enemy. Also are often the first, the last and sometimes the only nuclear option of a superpower against the other depending on the target being attacked and its location.

In fact Russia is unable to control all of it's airspace, which is gigantic, but has returned to invest in it and with the accentuation of dispute for the Arctic was again a priority.


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