4th General For Each Faction, Have anyone thought about it ? Options

[The_Hunter]

Probably not the best one I made.

It's all for kicks and giggles anyway so no reason to worry about that

I must say tho that i find it realy interesting to read through all these and alot more interesting stuff has actualy come up in this thread then i would have thought it would from community developed ideas.

[Shiro]

Place a million monkeys on a million typewriters and they might throw a coherrent suggestion together.

[__CrUsHeR]

Place a million monkeys on a million typewriters and they might throw a coherrent suggestion together.

You need to make this comment - compare the fans with monkeys in typewriter?

This post has been edited by __CrUsHeR: 12 Jun 2013, 14:56

[__CrUsHeR]

Arthur "Iron Town" Miller

Rank: General
Branch: US Army 5th Special Forces Group (Airborne)
Stationed: Fort Bragg, North Carolina, USA
Tactics: Urban Warfare


Exclusive Units

1. Ghost (replaces Pathfinder)
Cost: $800
Eliminates the infantry with a single shot and not reveal your position when performing the shot.

2. Disruptor Tank (replaces Microwave Tank)
Cost: $800
Disables AND causes damage to the enemy structures.


Exclusive Upgrades

1. Counter Sniper Training
Allows the Ghost eliminate targets garrisoned inside civilian structures.

2. Grenade Launcher
The Sentry Drone is able to clear occupied structures and atack enemy infantry with flashbang grenades. This upgrade is not "global".


Exclusive General Powers:

1. LRAD (Long Range Acoustic Device)
Creates a device at the selected location invisible to the enemy, in a few seconds the device forces enemy infantry to abandon garrisoned structures - including China bunkers, GLA tunnels and ECA fortifications - becoming vulnerable to attacks, outside the structures infantry succumbs to intense sound and is disabled. If the fragile device is located it can be destroyed.

2. HALO (High Altitude Military Parachuting) Drop (replaces Paradrop)
An aircraft flying at high-altitude drop infantry units on the battlefield.

[Nemanja]

Place a million monkeys on a million typewriters and they might throw a coherrent suggestion together.

Then you are one lazy monkey that just scratches his balls in the corner while others are typing.

[Genmotty]

Can't understand why people don't get the "2 out of 3" rule.

--------------------

How the heck can an ECA sub faction win a game without both heavy armour and artillery? Spamming Infantry like China?

Well if there is '4 generals...'.

I'm brainstorming shiz & giggles stuff, it's not really meant to fit the rest of the design ethos, because these are just hypothetical ideas, rather than actual hard suggestions. Although if the team ever likes any of the ideas they are free to have it since I can't model for shit.



Well, you have commandos that can attack without revealing themselves (mostly), you still have Howitzer platforms. Get a 'free GP ability' for the Bulldog with the R&D centre as well as all the normal defences sans cannon emplacement because that is more specifically Dutch, although I suppose the Italians could also build them, so perhaps they should be allowed, but then its much the same as Wilhelm...and IIRC it has been mentioned that Wilhelm gets a tunnel network too.

But more importantly, you have an 'unstoppable nuke' once you get to level 5 that can also double as a tunnel network. Hence you would need quite a considerable nerf in other ways. In essence you've got the best artillery going...just that it goes under the earth, rather than through the air...Pandora without hte 'crystal cannon'.

1. Ghost (replaces Pathfinder)
Cost: $800
Eliminates the infantry with a single shot and not reveal your position when performing the shot.

There is good reason that the Pathfinder was nerfed to silencer mode because it really does undermine the usefulness of infantry, hence the metagame would push towards tanks, and somewhat the over use of AT missile units in comparison.

With the pathfinder 'as is' you can still present a formidable anti-infantry firepower, but without it being the kind of 'stick him out in the middle of nowhere' infuriating the other player(s) having to spend time with a scout unit. Your units 'effectiveness' is downgraded for the same level of 'annoyance'. This was a good move via the dev team IMHO.



As for the Russian Federation the last on my list I had some difficulty with ideas, since I have two concepts equally different, but also sharing some niche ethos here is one of them;




Semyon “The Khan� Moskvitin

Tactics: 'Snatched Earth'
Restrictions: No Mista / No Sentinel, Kodiak, Golem
Boons: Rhino Tanks / Wartracks / Krepost / Relay Station / More cash income revenue
Station: 'Traktiongrad' North-east of Bratsk

Bio:
Never having set foot in Europe, Moskvitin is still the mastermind behing the 'snatched earth' strategy of dismantling European civilian infrastructure and stripping supply depots of goods to be sent into the rear.

Moskvitin might trace his ancestry back to the mongols or khanates of the Siberian traps, yet is staunchly old school Russian. He is the last of the so called 'corrupt' old guard commanders that suvorov ousted from the military Moskvitin has been long implicated in much of the corruption and sales of old soviet equipment to the Chinese and GLA forces, yet with his 'loyal' divisions and industrial empire out east has been so far able to hold onto his rank and power.

Notwithstanding these rumours, Moskvitin is a powerful figure in east Siberia and has provided several infrastructure developments in mineral extraction, and in selling coal to fuel the power stations back west. Such 'industrialisation of the east' has not occurred in isolation the Chinese dragon watches eagerly and probes the borders from bases in Mongolia almost daily to keep a watchful eye on Russian affairs.

Tasked with far eastern border security, industrial production, and in keeping the vast red army armour reserves ready for deployment should other more respectable commanders need them. These events haven't enamoured Moskvitin with either the Chinese or Suvorov at being thrown the 'old guard' bone.

Thus when the other Russian generals cut swaves across Europe he was quick to step in and 'aquire' the logistics contracts to move men and material to the western front, while returning loot and pillage back from it. While much is consumed in western Russia, it is estimated just as much disappears east of the Urals..


Special Units:

Taiga Wartrack:
With a much upgraded chassis, cross country tank treads and mounting both armoured skirts and an improved 7.7mm chaingun mount. The Taiga Wartrack is a very robust piece of logistics kit that has been compared equal to infantry fighting vehicles such as the Bradley or Lynx.

What makes it unique is that these vehicles are not infantry fighting ones, but logistical! and are adequately defended enough to remove supplies under combat. The much improved tread and transmission also allows them to carry just under double the amount of combat supplies than the standard design, thus allowing Moskvitins logistics corps to rapidly strip out a region for resources, aggressively if needs be.

Wartracks can also upgrade with the reactive armour upgrade from the industrial plant.

Individual Wartacks have the option to replace their machinegun mount with either a Rely Node which generates a small revenue from media streams (~$5 / 5s)*, or RPG mount which gives logistics corps better defence against armoured threats.


Rhino Tanks:
Replaces Kodiak Tank: Being in charge of Russian armour reserves, Moskvitin has got cheap and easy access to deploying old soviet equipment, as such his standard front line tank is the antiqued Rhino.


Commissar:
Build limit: 3
Requires: Industrial Plant

Moskvitins hang back to the Soviet Era includes more that just fields of rusting tanks. In occupation duties and keeping morale on the Sino-Russian Border he has revived his only personal cadre of political commissars tasked with keeping discipline in the ranks and preventing rumours from spreading, to Beijing, or Moscow. It is not known where Moskvitin recruits these individuals from yet they all have stern uncompromising character much like the General himself and the inhuman nerves of steel to stand even when those around them fall or to be the last man in the charge to insure that no conscript will retreat from cowardice.

Armed only with a sub-machinegun, Commissars are given clearance to call in an additional 12 conscripts at location via paradrop to sustain a defence or attack (~3:00min cooldown). Commissars may also meter our 'field discipline' as an ability sacrificing a coward in the ranks to inspire the rest.


Krepost:
Replaces Kashitan. The wilds of Siberia are too vast for Kashtan air/ground defence turrets to be suitably effective, especially when the western Russian commanders find them of particular effectiveness against European infantry and choppers.

In manning the vast border with china and keeping tabs on the countryside the Krepost has become a staple defence A medium earthen work trench system with six firing positions and an observation and radio antenna to radio in with commanders are more than sufficient to dig infantry in and hold positions in a light skirmish.

While conscripts are still partially vulnerable to small arms, and very vulnerable to fire, toxin and radiation hazards, a small firing pit is better than no firing pit, and while the Krepost is still expensive and slower to build compared to European fortifications, it does boast a much better field of view on a par with your average European guard tower, even if it confers no other defensive boons.

Depending on the garrison, a Krepost can be customised to deal with infantry, stealth threats, air or tank and is a surprising tough structure against direct fire weapons, but anything much heavier like artillery will overrun Krepost positions with ease. Hence any serious defensive line should kit itself out with RPG, Relay Stations or Air Raid component towers.


Relay Station:
Upgrade for Component Tower (~$1,500)
Provides (~$5 / 5s)*

Part of the 'snatched earth' stragtery involves utilising captured equipment and putting it to good use. Moskvitin thus has emulated European telecommunication nodes with his Russian home grown ones, that sport both media connections, and a light flak autocannon for light air and ground defence


Special Techs:

Industrial Plant tech: Black Contracts
Replaces: Koalition Gun

Not all of Moskvitins production gets ends up in Russian hands, some of it is sold on to other buyers for profit. By signing Black Market contracts Arms Suppliers can sell more arms at higher prices (+$1 per sale), but this has a knock on effect of making all vehicles cost 5% longer to produce as the industrial plants are forced to produce components for these extra contracts as well.


Strategy:
With a much improved logistics corps it is possible to utilise wartracks in an offensive role to more effectively gather supplies from map regions without having to have a supply centre nearby. The additional carrying capacity also gives an increased cash flow from primary supply sources allowing a more rapid deployment of light units, and the establishment of map perimeters and control.

This theme continues into the later stages of a skirmish by being able to put these resources to use in expanding revenue streams that will allow for the mass mobilisation of reservist units to push home enemy forces from the region.

Lacking some of the more modern equipment is however a significant weakness that needs such mass production put to good use, since neither sentinels or golems can be produced. Hence a more robust defensive strategy may be required to push forward map control without armoured spearhead units.


*repayment time should be around 30mins or so, hence is more of a tertiary income stream, rather than secondary. Helps with the 'steam roller' aspect.

[MARS]

Here's my shot at a fourth ECA General.

General Tadeusz Kamyszek
Stationed in Krakow, Poland
Speciality: Covert Intervention

Infantry:
Para-Sappers (acts as a replacement for Felins, Panzerfausts and Engineers): As qualified paratroopers of the 6th Polish Airborne Brigade, the Para-Sappers are skilled frontline soldiers and competent field engineers at the same time. Armed with an assault rifle by default.
Individual upgrades: ex-Soviet LPO flamethrower OR Carl Gustav recoilless rifle. Each upgrade permanently replaces the assault rifle, allowing you to turn a soldier into an anti-infantry or an anti-vehicle specialist.
Abilities: Deploy for repairs (just like Engineers). Throw Satchel Charge (throws a timed pack of explosives at short range, unlocked after a global upgrade)
Starstreak Trooper: Essentially an ECA version of the Igla Trooper, but he does turn invisible when standing stationary with the launcher equipped, allowing him to effectively ambush aircraft.
Battle Medic (replaces the Combat Medic): Armed with a proper assault rifle and about as good at fighting as the Para-Sapper, but not efficient/economical as a replacement.
Ability: Triage Tent (sets up a small, easily destroyed tent which automatically refunds any wounded infantry within its radius)
Assault Grenadier (replaces the regular Grenadier): Armed with an RGA-86 grenade launcher. Doesn't have to deploy but has less range/rate of fire than regular grenadiers. Wears a heavy armour suit (think MW Juggernaut) that allows him to close in and engage at short range.
Ability: Can switch between standard HE/frag and Tear Gas grenades. Rapid Barrage (fires a quick barrage of 15 grenades at a circular area but needs to reload afterwards)
GROM Operator (replaces Frank Jaeger): Armed with an assault rifle by default. Has the same abilities as Jaeger but with a much longer cooldown. Can be produced in numbers.
Individual upgrades: Suppressed Bor sniper rifle OR SPAS-12 shotgun. Each upgrade permanently replaces the assault rifle, allowing you to turn a soldier into a long-range or short-range infantry killer.

Vehicles:
ATV: A simple quad bike that comes with a Para-Sapper by default. Similar to the GLA combat bike but without a standard attack of its own unless...
Individual upgrade: Tor .50 sniper rifle. Mounts a powerful anti-material rifle on the front of the ATV which allows the driver to damage and irritate vehicles while standing still.
Raider (replaces the Lynx, visually based on the AIL Desert Raider from BF2 Special Forces): Can carry six infantry units. The first 1-3 passengers operate three forward-facing, rapid-fire machine guns which have a small splash radius against masses of infantry.
Individual upgrade: Replace the upper MG with a heavy grenade launcher that makes it more effective against light vehicles.
Zuzana: Based on the eponymous artillery vehicle from the Czech republic. Very fast for an artillery unit, but extremely thin-skinned. Can switch between HE/frag shells for general purpose/anti-personnell bombardment and precise, low-splash anti-tank shells which are fired in a flat trajectory.
Sagaie (replaces the Leopard, based on the eponymous French vehicle): Very light and very fast.
Abilities: Launch Tear Gas grenades (fires a bunch of TG grenades in a pattern similar to Russian smoke grenades. This is to make up for the vehicle's lack of armour and makes it the ideal opening move to an ambush. Fire HESH Round (manually targeted at an enemy tank which takes little damage but ends up stunned for a brief period of time. Fire Shredder Round (same as normal, requires upgrade)

Aircraft:
Sokol Utility Helicopter (replaces Tiger and Wotan): Very versatile due to having a variety of upgrades, all of which are applied individually and mutually exclusive. Can transport six soldiers.
Air Combat Suite: Allows the Sokol to place Icarus mines and engage air-targets with Meteor air-to-air missiles which basically turn the Sokol into a flying Chaparral.
Ground Support Suite: Equips the Sokol with two side-mounted rocket pods and a 25mm cannon
Abilities: Touchdown (The Sokol lands on the ground and becomes invisible, yet unable to perform any of its abilities). Deploy Supplies (The Sokol airdrops a sturdy crate of munitions and medical supplies which heal/buff infantry in a radius.

Can't think of any unique upgrades/powers at this time, but they would probably entail things like camouflage, battlefield awareness and unconventional tactics such as booby traps on supplies/structures.

[Arcus2611]

Here's my idea for an ECA resistance general. They'd be rather fragile, focusing on ambushing, luring the enemy into killzones and that sort of thing whe still keeping the ECA's focus on defensive operations (hopefully). Too lazy to come up with a name, and the list jsn'r complete but I'll just throw this in for now.

Defences:
Mine dispenser: Stealthed. Dispenses mines around it.
Shelter: Cloaked building that can hide several infantry or one vehicle.
Rocket Battery: Replaces the mortar pit. Same dps but slower rate of fire, so more damage upfront.

Defences otherwise the same (the gun turret is replaced by whatever the other two generals are getting)

Infantry:
Patriot: Armed with semi-auto rifle with long range. Can upgrade with either a Panzerfaust or shotgun, after which it can switch between the rifle and the other weapon.
Sapper: Can plant explosive charges, booby trap buildjngs and build battlefield obstacles, but no repair ability
Mobile Anti-Tank Gun: Same as Shockwave, but with appearance changed to fit the ECA.

Vehicles:
Dingo Armoured Car: Armed with grenade launcher that can switch between airburst and high explosive. Can carry 5 infantry.
Bergerpanzer - Cheap dedicated repair vehicle. Can also repair structures one at a time like the dozer.
Langusta - MLRS that fires high explosive rockets. Can also use submunition filled rockets for large groups of enemies.

[X1Destroy]

Another idea of mine, an ECA general who is strong in both offense and defense

General Ursarkar E. Creed.

Defenses:

Everybuilding is a bunker.

Supply center have 3 slots, War factory have 4 slots. Barrack have 3 slots. Deployment zone have 5 slots. R&D have none and is the only exception.

Other buildings should follow the same example.

Troops inside the buildings cannot be killed by anti-garrisoned weapons.

Listening post act simillar to component tower but the upgrades are levels, not different individuals. Replaces guard tower, skyshield and gun turret. Have no weapon by default but can detect stealth. Also serve as a tunnel network, but cannot hold vehicles inside.

1st level upgrade give it a dual autocannon. Have good range and can attack both ground and air target.

2nd level upgrade replaces the dual autocannon with a heavy flak cannon and add 2 missile pods. Have even more range, large AOE and become effective against vehicles.

3rd level upgrade add 3 garrison slots for infantry, and add more armor.

No bulldog turret. But the new GP let you deploy a stealth listening post at anywhere on the map.

Mortar pit is replace by the deployable mortar team. Have the same stats. Mortar team is immuned to EMP, toxin and radiation. But sniper still kill them good.

Infantry:

Guardsmen squad. Replaces Felin and Panzerfaust. Is a group of 3, 2 is armed with autogun and 1 with multipurpose rocket launcher that can attack both ground and air. Expensive to train but sure is worth it. Upgrade add a grenade launcher trooper to the squad, have good range, effective against most targets and can clear garrisoned buildings. Squad can be split into individual members to be put inside vehicles and buildings.

Heavy weapon team. Replaces Grenadier. Have autogun to defense themselves while not deployed.

Can switch between heavy machine gun and high caliber autocannon and have longer range. Highly durable, cannot be 1 hit kill by sniper once deployed.

Officer is a new unit. Heals all infantry around him like a medic. Armed with an autopistol. Can execute desserter to make other troops fight harder. Is very tough compared to the medic. Can throw EMP grenades at vehicles. Much more expensive than medic.

Combat engineer is armed with a pistol, can set minefields around the battlefield. Repairs friendly vehicles and buildings as well as capture enemy buildings.

Mortar team, as said before.

All infantry cost and build speed is greatly reduced with the conscription upgrade

Vehicles:

Chimera APC replaces Lyxn, have an MG by default. More durable, troops can fire outside with the bunker individual upgrade. Can repair friendly vehicles and deploy to repair buildings with the recovery vehicle upgrade.

This general still have the Leopard, but instead of putting infantry inside the tank to operate the MG, pay 200$ to purchase it directly from the tank.

Pandur is not available.

Jagdmamut is not available. Replaced by the fast Tank hunter walker unit, have a single laser cannon that is devastating against armored vehicles and decent against buildings.

Baneblade super heavy tank act as the ECA equivalent to Sentinel and Overlord Good against mass groups of infantry, have long range but not very effective against tanks.

Basillisk replaced both Mortar track and Claymore. Have the same range and higher AOE than a Nuke Cannon. The bombarment ability let it fire a barrage of shells nearby Frank Jaeger's position, regardless of where ever he is on the map.

Wotan and Gepard is replaced by Hydra Flak tank, can attack both ground and air targets. Have longer range when attacking aircrafts.

Last but not least, he uses technician as builder instead of excavator So his tech cannot be captured

This post has been edited by X1Destroy: 19 Jul 2014, 10:43

[Joe Kidd]

Cool ideas you got there

I like the technician idea most

I was always hoping that an ECA gen would have an infantry builder, since 4 of 5 factions use vehicle builders

Maybe Willem? To fit his defensive/infantry theme?

[H3adSh00t]

Last but not least, he uses technician as builder instead of excavator So his tech cannot be captured

Brainwash

[X1Destroy]

Brainwash

Forgot about that The POW logic would works well here

[Knjaz.]

A bit more on the "mobilization general" idea I've had. What makes this general different from all others, is that with increase in tiers, his units become weaker in their stats, not stronger - but at same time, much more cost-efficient and numerous. Which means, he follows normal Russian strategies during tier 0 and 1, but at Tier 2 he gains an ability to mass produce weaker versions of some of his units.

============================================================================
General Nikolai Ignatov
Stationed in Yekaterinburg, Ural Military District.
Speciality: Mobilized and Reserve forces.

Relies on old Soviet equipment and mobilization versions of newer equipment to achieve victory.

Upgrades:
Does not have access to: Coalition Upgrade, Mass Production upgrade, Missile Upgrade.

Mass Mobilization, 2000$: Substitutes Mass Production. Does not reduce the cost of your units. Instead, allows you to turn your warfactories into Mobilized state.

Armored Reserves 1000$: Begins re-activation procedures at Reserve Bases. Unlocks "Refurbishment plant" building add-ons, that turns them into equivalent of reinforcement plant. Industrial plant refurbishes 2 units, instead of one.

Refurbishment Plant Add-On, 800$: Available for all buildings, that are capable of vehicle production - i.e. WarFactory (both mobilized and non-mobilized), Command Center, Industrial Plant.
Allows those buildings to act as a Reinforcement pad, producing one of 3 units each "X time". Unit type is chosen randomly. Hammer tank - 50%. Shilka - 25%. Gvozdika - 25.
Does not affect building's production capabilities (which means, you can use those CCs/IP's/WF's normally). Edit: I know this would be uncodeable, so see Post Scriptum in the bottom.

NBC Protection kit 1500$: - All vehicles receive X times less damage from Toxins and Radiation, and are more resistant to EMP strikes.
"Reserve forces are meant to join in case of large scale conflict, if constant readiness forces are unable to deal with the threat. It also means that battlefield will likely be heavily irradiated or poisoned. As such, all vehicles are equipped NBC protection kits."



Infantry:

Conscripts are being produced in packs of 2. Cost 200$, takes as much time as it'd take for 2 conscripts to get produced one by one. It's there only for the ability to queue units.
Partisan Squad: Similiar to volunteer squad or mob, but weaker.(//might as well be like volunteer squad without horde bonus). Stealthed.

Vehicles:
Does not have access to Mstas, Teslas, Golems, Buratinos. Sentinels can be built, but without Mass Production, it's not recommended.

Akatsiya (2S3) - small, mobile self-propelled gun that saw service in USSR times. Similiar to BMD Mortars in it's performance, with a longer range (max range - 360). Due to gun elevation and projectile trajectory, has almost no blind zone. Available at Tier 1.

Pion (2S7) - a heavy 203mm Self-propelled gun, dealing devastating blows at high distance, slow refire rate. (Nearly less DPS than Akatsiya, far more alpha damage and AoE). Quite costly, can't be used as a main artillery.
Special Ability: Fires a tactical nuke at a target location (within gun range). Stronger than NC's shell, but has a far longer cooldown. Available at Tier 2.

BREM-2 - Soviet/Russian Armored Repair & Evacuation Vehicle, built on the base of BMP-1, replacement for MTP. Armed with a weak 7,62mm machinegun, has better armor than MTP (incl. NBC kit upgrade), comes with 2 conscripts in it (transports up to 2 infantry units), amphibious.

Arm's Supplier - Costs 10% less, since mass production is unavailable. Still costs more than for any other Russian generals.


Reserve units:
Hammer - A refurbished T-72. Similiar to Rhino, but with slightly more armor and without ATGM.
Shilka - Soviet era AA system.
Gvozdika (2S1) - Light, mobile, amphibious 122mm SPG.


Aircraft/Helicopters:
Either no changes at all (but remember, mass production is not there!), since this general already got alot of unique units OR:

Mi-17 - transport helicopter with some fire support ability with small AoE. Similiar to SHW one.
MIG-31 - an old Soviet era interceptor, that is known for it's sturdy airframe, that is very resistant to corrosion. Can only attack air.
Su-24 - Soviet frontline bomber. Flies over target and drops several HE bombs.


Buildings:
Warfactory: Has Refurbishment Plant addon's and Mobilized Production upgrades.
Warfactory (Mobilized):
Loses it's ability to produce Grumbles and Sentinels. Has Refurbishment Plant add-on. In Mobilized state, it produces downgraded versions of Kodiaks, Tunguskas and BMPs.

Kodiak(M), 20% cut in armor, 10% cut in refire rate and firepower, loses an ability to deploy smokes(?), 20% speed increase (due to lighter armor and well, to help with SAGE's horrible pathfinding), produces 25%-30% faster. 50% price reduction.
Tunguska(M) - 40% cut in price, 15% armor reduction, loses it's missiles, 25% faster production speed.
BMP(M) - it's gun is being replaced with a 30mm autocannon, 15% armor reduction, 40% cut in price, 25% faster production speed
Akatsiyas and Pions are being produced faster and are 20% cheaper.

Industrial Plant: Acts as similarly to reinforcement pad, producing tanks. Receives a free additional refurbishment plant add-on after the upgrade.

Command Center: Has Refurbishment Plant add-ons and special ability. Costs 50% more, requires 50% more time to build, has 20% more HP.
Homeland advantage: When in 500 range of own command center, all forces have 10% better Rate of Fire.

P.S.: But since random unit production is uncodeable, there would be 3 Refurbishment Plant's add-on's , each for it's own unit type. Only one can be applied at the time. Tank refurbishment would be most cost-efficient, while artillery refurbishment would be least cost-efficient.
All Refurbishment Plant add-on's would be more "cost-efficient" than secondary economy units. (i.e., you'll get more Hammers or Shilkas or Gvozdika's if you'll invest 2000$ into refurbishment plants, than if you'll invest 2000$ into Arms Suppliers. That doesn't take into account cost of the initial building, only add-on itself, of course.)


General Powers:

Tactical Nuclear Strike: Substitutes Tu-22 Strike, 3 levels. Requests a nuclear support from general Zhukov, who is his old drinking buddy. Sends 1/2/3 small-yield nuclear missiles at a designated area. Less damage than Chinese Arty strike, more AoE and radiation.
Reserve Drop: Drops 2 Rhinos and 2 BRDMs at first level, adds 2 Shilkas at second level, 1 more Rhino, BRDM and 1 BREM-2 at third.
Emergency Recovery: 50% more AOE, also heals all units within radius for small amount of time (like emergency repair). Available at Rank 3.

edit2: Fixed RP's description in Post Scriptum, above, and some spelling errors.
edit3: Changed Reserve drop lvl3, replaced the silly Arms Supplier drop. (just tried to make that power worth investing 3 points, but I guess it'd be too much...)

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 18 Jun 2013, 19:43

[MARS]

Another interesting concept. I personally like the inclusion of Cold War era vehicles and the theme of a General who is somewhat based around economics. Personally, I wouldn't mind adapting some of these elements for Zhukov (namely the NBC Protection, Partisans and BREM) but that'll be something for The Hunter to decide.

[Streanger]

I welcome. I have such idea for Russia: the General, whose specialization is improvements of available armies. Primary armies of this general especial are not allocated with anything, but due to these improvements, it is possible to arrange them under any tactics.

[__CrUsHeR]

THE SAP FACTION:

The concept of the faction consists of rapid assault, however not to the point of being considered 'hit-&-run' as the GLA. Most of the amphibious vehicles are light and to perform surprise attacks. The units are specialized.

Things related to faction:
-Biodiesel
-Renewable Energy
-Rapid Assault
-Active Camouflage
-Weather Control
-Ore and Minerals
-Recycling

NOTE: the list below is not complete, I still need to think about the rest of the stuff like remaining Gen. Stars and Generals, though I already have a mental planning.

INFANTRY


Tier 0

Jungle Warrior ($200):
Basically infantry, LAR-29 (Light Assault Rifle-29).

Bazzoka Fighter ($300):
AT infantry, AT-4 bazzoka, no AA.

Heavy Gunner ($600):
Heavy infantry, AA, MAG Machinegun, Explosive Charges vs vehicles, structures.


Tier 2

Chameleon ($1500):
Hero unit, Active Camouflage Aura Device (units around Chameleon become stealth), Madsen Machinegun, special ammunitions, shoots at semi-automatic mode.


VEHICLES


Tier 0

Dozer ($1000):
Builds structures, repairs the damaged structures.

Ant Buggy ($300):
Scout unit, detect and disarm mines.

Supply Tractor ($800):
Collecting $400 in supplements.

Kaingang IFV ($800):
IFV, light wheeled vehicle, 40mm Autocannon, carry 5 troops, able to cross the water.

Cruise ($900):
Light AA - AG vehicle, light wheeled vehicle, able to cross the water. Mini Missiles.


Tier 1

Alligator Tank ($900):
MBT, light wheeled vehicle, 90mm Autocannon, able to cross the water, launching a salvo of three shots before the next recharge.


Tier 2

Jaguar Tank ($1400):
Heavy tank, tank with treads, 120mm Cannon.

Astro MLRS ($1600):
MLRS, light wheeled vehicle.

Anaconda ($1600):
Heavy AA, light wheeled vehicle, engage multiple targets, Missiles.


AIRCRAFT


Tier 0

Cougar ($1200):
Light transport helicopter, carries 5 infantry units, Light Machinegun.

Urutau ($1000):
Assault helicopter, 20mm Autocannon, AA missiles.


Tier 1

Spy Probe ($200):
Stealth, reconnaissance.


Tier 2

Tucano ($1800):
Heavy assault aircraft, turboprop aircraft, AA AT .50 Cal. Machinegun, Laser Guided Bombs.



STRUCTURES


Tier 0

Headquarters ($2000):
Train Scouts, Dozers.

Barracks ($500):
Train Infantry, healing the wounded in combat.

Biodiesel Reactor ($800):
Basic powerplant, 5 units of energy.

Supply Warehouse ($1500):
Produces Supply Tractors, stores resources.

Casemate ($500):
Defense, single soldier inside, .50 Cal. Machinegun.


Tier 1

Airfield ($1000):
Produces aircrafts, repairs damaged aircrafts.

Warfactory ($2000):
Produces vehicles, repairs the damaged vehicles.

Meteorological Institute ($1000):
Provides Radar, Reveals the map through the upgrade Aerostatic Spying.

Military Academy ($1000):
Enables Tech Center, upgrades.

Tech Center ($2000):
Enables the structures and units Tier2, upgrades.

Defense Position ($300):
Defense structure.

Anti-Tank Gun ($800):
Transforms the Defense Position on a AT 155mm Cannon.

Flak Cannon ($700):
Transforms the Defense Position on a AA 88mm Flak Cannon.


Tier 2

Ore Refinery ($2500):
Generates extra income, only one Ore Refinery can be built per time.

Ore Silo ($1400):
Need the Ore Refinery, generates extra income.


UPGRADES

Renewable Generator ($400):
All the structures - with the exception of defensive - to receive this upgrade becomes self-sufficient, not consuming energy of Biodiesel Reactor. No global upgrade.

Capture Building ($1000):
Allows Jungle Warriors to capture enemy structures and neutral tech buildings.

Extra Charge ($800):
The Heavy Gunner Explosive Charges cause extra damage and clears garrisoned structures.

Ant Mine ($800):
The Ant Buggy is able to install a landmine.

Optical System ($1200):
The Cruise and Spy Probe gains the ability to detection.

Medical Support ($300):
The Cougar and Kaingang IFV healing infantry around, no Global Upgrade.

Hyper Tucano ($1200):
Increases the armor of the Tucano and its load capacity of bombs.

Aerostatic Spying ($1500):
Reveals the map.

Condor Missiles ($2000):
The Kaingang and Jaguar receives an AT-AA missile system (AA only to Kaingang).

Advanced Softwares ($2000):
Increases the range of artillery units and Anaconda AA.

Ore Purification ($2500):
Increases the income produced by the Ore Refinery and Ore Silo.

War Recycling ($1500):
When a SAP vehicle, aircraft or structure is destroyed a percentage of investment returns.


GEN POWERS


RANK 1

Guerrilla Tactics:
Infantry T-0 becomes stealth.

Jaguar Tank:
Enables the production of the Jaguar Tank at the War Factory.


RANK 3

Methane Strike:
KC 130, a bomb containing Methane Gas is dropped releasing the gas in an area. The civilian garrisoned structures are cleaned and infantry ignites in contact with Methane Gas, vehicles suffer damage. The cloud of methane must be attacked to be destroyed.

Weather Change I:
KC 130, Silver Iodide, Weather Change, enemy units in the area of effect have speed and turn rate reduced.

Weather Change II:
KC 130, Silver Iodide, Wheater Change, enemy units in the area of effect have speed and turn rate reduced.

Weather Change III:
KC 130, Silver Iodide, Wheater Change, enemy units in the area of effect have speed and turn rate reduced.

This post has been edited by __CrUsHeR: 17 Jun 2013, 19:26

[Genmotty]

General Ursarkar E. Creed

I read that and groaned; "Oh no..." out aloud...

P.S.: But since random unit production is uncodeable, there would be 3 Refurbishment Plant's add-on's , each for it's own unit type. Only one can be applied at the time. Tank refurbishment would be most cost-efficient, while artillery refurbishment would be least cost-efficient.
All Refurbishment Plant add-on's would be more "cost-efficient" than secondary economy units. (i.e., you'll get more Hammers or Shilkas or Gvozdika's if you'll invest 2000$ into refurbishment plants, than if you'll invest 2000$ into Arms Suppliers. That doesn't take into account cost of the initial building, only add-on itself, of course.)

Can't you use the same mob logic, you create a 'nexus unit' that spawns 1 of the various unit types. Thus every time you build it you can in principle get a different unit that is 'spawned onto the nexus', you have to make it so it can't reclaim units and the nexus moves with the thing...possibly a bit buggy. That is if the Technical code itself can't be used. I'm relatively positive that there is a way to do this thinking back to when I de-mob'ed mobs into single infantry men...

Homeland advantage: When in 500 range of own command centre, all forces deal 25% more damage and have 25% better refire rate.

Actually I think the ECA should get this ability right now! Call it Territorial Pride or something along those lines and tone down the buff quite a bit to more like 10% damage (not fire rate) around their Regional and Field Commands. This would give a lot more incentive to place the command centres strategically and use them to buff your defence.

We shouldn't given them an ROF bonus, because with the Pandora it could be abused badly, in just the same way for the Russians it coupled with the Air Raid Sirens and Grumbles and you would have automatic Grumble AA. No...Just no....no....ok....no....

I can also envisage nasty Tesla towers and/or automatic Sentinels and things. At lease with the ECA they have build limits on their 'uber units' which helps avoid that issue.




In general I like your take on a 'reservist' general, however I'm not sure if the balance might be a bit wonky, you have Conscripts being produced 'in twos', yet Russia is nowhere near the population powerhouse that China is IRL or in the ROTR Universe, also just because its still a conscription based military doesn't mean that we should be giving them mega infantry buffs since Russia is quite a bit more of the 'Tracktion Fist' mega mania and less the 'Infantry Wave' which we might give to China, doing the whole 1950s thing.

Likewise 'mobilising' I like that idea a fair bit, like the cash bounty, have multiple levels (~3) of 'mass production upgrade' that decrease the time per unit perhaps. However the thing we don't want to do is turn Russia into 'spammy spammy semi-uber, with chinesy crappyness tagged on'. No while I think an economic bonus is a very nice them representing (re)industrialisation of Russia and its eastern regions, I don't think giving the Chinese model for this is the right way to do it.

In terms of the Tunguska / Sheilka they are fairly self similar, just that the Tunguska has missiles attached creating a new model for the same thing in effect might be OTT, likewise there is a lot of artillery units in that generals outlay! 3 Special ones, sure they might fit/replace the Mista and TOS, but it looks again fairly Zhukov and while I know the Russians are artillery nuts for the most part....that's still a lot of guns...




What I do like is the notion of giving MiGs for the Reserve airforce, this is a good idea (replace both aircraft with duel purpose MiGs slightly better than the Chinese ones due to missile tech...?). I also like the suggestion of arming the MTP and giving it conscripts 'ready to go' for repaired vehicles (that was my notion with giving the Commissar additional Conscripts for free, but that was also partly for theme), since it brings about a whole notion of 'units that can operate together on their own away from anywhere important' which if you are going to stick your reserves anywhere in Russia it well beyond the frontlines where it is out of reach totally.

I think however the emergency repair radius is good at its current size it might be a bit OP to make it massive, and render MTPs potentially less useful, which if the notion is to give a flavour unit, you want it to be at the heart of the matter.



NBC is also fairly good, but then all main battle tanks should have it, yet all bar the Golem are still effected. I think it would be better for reasons of coherency to assume that the Golem represents 'Nth degree' protection, well and beyond the normal levels of protection, on the kind of level where the crew "sits-n-shits" in their hazmat suits and never takes the gasmask off like Alexandr




-----------------------------------------------------------

Defences:
Mine dispenser: Stealthed. Dispenses mines around it.
Shelter: Cloaked building that can hide several infantry or one vehicle.
Rocket Battery: Replaces the mortar pit. Same dps but slower rate of fire, so more damage upfront.

Defences otherwise the same (the gun turret is replaced by whatever the other two generals are getting)

Infantry:
Patriot: Armed with semi-auto rifle with long range. Can upgrade with either a Panzerfaust or shotgun, after which it can switch between the rifle and the other weapon.
Sapper: Can plant explosive charges, booby trap buildjngs and build battlefield obstacles, but no repair ability
Mobile Anti-Tank Gun: Same as Shockwave, but with appearance changed to fit the ECA.

Vehicles:
Dingo Armoured Car: Armed with grenade launcher that can switch between airburst and high explosive. Can carry 5 infantry.
Bergerpanzer - Cheap dedicated repair vehicle. Can also repair structures one at a time like the dozer.
Langusta - MLRS that fires high explosive rockets. Can also use submunition filled rockets for large groups of enemies.

The Mine Dispenser is a good notion, however with the Mole Minelayer we have a mobile version that is much better in terms of laying minefields, having a static building doesn't really help. Still if we didn't have the mole...

The Shelter is again a nice concept, yet in PvP any player worth his salt is going to spot your 'unload ambush' the second you do it, in the next few mins he's going to call in the airpower to kill the shelter and garrisoned unit. It's also somewhat micro intensive to set up in the first place and use. While it would be a great addition for campaign maps, it would be less useful in a general game.

The Rocket battery I don't have much problem with, its a bit more Ruskie than ECA, but in principle the ECA lack a strong high alpha artillery unit, unless you count the Pandora and Howitzer Platform in that, however that is partly due to gameplay in allowing artillery a chance to 'chip away at' base defenses even if it can be targeted in return.

Indeed, who else would like to see the Germans in the ECA with a V3 launcher unit....? Just me? Oh, ok... *cries in a corner*

The Patriot is a bit like a cross between Hauptman Jaeger and normal infantry a bit :S in my mind, likewise the Sapper is a cross between dozer and Commando. Above all the ECA doesn't really have the AT gun feel, they have the Jadgmamutt for that role (although I keep thinking it needs a turning speed boost!!!)

I alway think that the team missed a good one with allowing engineers to repair indervidual buildings like dozers can, rather than with the repair raidius thingy...but that's just me.


EDIT4:
Also @MARS

Was thinking along the lines of yours and Re_Simeone , then I thought;

“You know old chap, Polish resistance in WWII and all that lot with code breaking and general awesomeness, what we need is some good old Polish Partisans armed with Molotov Cocktails, booby traps and all manner of sabotage nastyness to screw over anybody.

...And old bean that is exactly where the shelter notion could come in, let partisand be able to 'build' a little 'OP for themselves' somewhere between guard tower 'I see you' and just stealthing up, or possibly just as a stealth and really weak version of the ECA fortification. Through in Molotovs effective at close range at tanks and you have a good ambush unit....

...While thinking on the same score, while giving the ECA a sniper might be horribly OP, a marksman with generally longer range and a 'might miss with rifle' type weapon code* and perhaps you might have something for keeping the infantry's heads down, best balenced so several have to be deployed to be effective with them missing more often than not...

...Then throw in the Czech shoot and scoot wheeled artillery (something like the 152mm DANA SpGH) as a Tier 1 artillery unit which fires 'en barrage' and is effective vs tanks and vehicles rather than infantry, and you are starting to build up a good force for the eastern resistance and vanguard which take the brunt of the Russian advance before the Germans get into battle...”


So Picking the best ideas and trying to combine them...good points...will muse on ideas...


*Use the scatter weapon template, and give yourself a small damage radius so you only hit (hopefully) one solider at a time, although could use a semi-auto sniper rifle or high powered one in the fluff to justify multiple hits, and then on every nth shot you send the damage radius well off and you have a unit that hits 'some' of the time, like a impromptu battlefield sniper.

This post has been edited by Genmotty: 17 Jun 2013, 21:21

[Pepo]

Crusher:i will like the idea of getting sap on the game,but i see then more like a faction center in,has you said,fast strikes(bliztkrieg anyone?)but also money getting,knowing that they are helping the russians in money getting.more or less like this:                   

SAP

Tactics: 
strong economy-the sap has one(if not the best) money getting of the game,being able to win a lot of money.has three ways of getting money
Bliezkrieg-ground forces are fast to enable then to get loads of ground.great attack  planes

structures:
HQ:builds dozers and scout.control powers  cost: 2000$ 
Barracks:build soldiers and research abilities cost:500$
Supply house:create collectors.first money gathering cost:1500$
Bio matter burner:produces energy cost :650$ power 6(requieres supply house)
Factory:build tanks and vehicles cost 2000 $(requieres supply house)
Air field:build planes cost: 1200 $,three long runaways,Pc:2(requieres bio matter burner)
Hidden lab :first tech building cost:1500$ ,unlocks units ,research techs,Pc:3(requieres bio matter burner & factory)
Pharmatheutic seller:generates money 50 $ each 4 seconds(i'm not sure what are the normal rates,but i think they are each 2 seconds) cost 1350 $ Pc:2(requieres hidden lab)
Stock exchange:second tech building,generates a lot of money (60 $ each second),limit:1,research technologies,cost :3500 $ pc:5 (requieres hidden lab)
The grand storm:superweapon ,6 min cooldown:A multiple missile launcher with a lot of small missiles.biggest area damage of all superweapons ,but does medium damage. pc:10 cost:5000$

Defenses:
-BAAS(basic anti air system)a turret armed with 8 unguided( follow planes for  3 seconds,then explodes)HE rockets.Each missile does a lot of damage and area of damage,althrougth it lack on accuracy.can't attack ground.cost 900$ pc:2 
-hidden pillbox: a camouflaged pill box armed with an auto cannon.efective against infantery and ligth vehicles,althrougth it can't effectivily damaged tanks.cost 750 $ 

Units:
HQ;
-Dozer:builder(kinda of obvious)have wheels 
-Scout:a soldier with some binoculars.basic scout.stealthed.can create a radar connection to provide  minimap(he create a tent and star working,immovile ).three tents will periodically reveal the map. Cost:400$

Supply house:
Collector:a van that collects resources,200 each trip.it is the fastest supply collector .cost:450$
Puma:an special collector unit.it works like a mobile supply drop:it can create recollectors to deposit resources in it.it is armed with a machine gun for self defense and can carry two units inside.cost:1500$ (requieres stock exchange)
Recolector:a person tha carries resources(100$ each trip).cost:300

Barracks:
-Militia:a soldier armed with a pump-up shoutgun,that make him effective at close range,can be upgraded with solid slugscost:175$

-Home defender:a soldier armed with old LAW launchers.does less damage than other anti tanks.effective when use in mass numbers.they can attack air targets.cost:200$

-Assault granadier:a soldier armed with a mobile grenade launcher.can throw(with a research) a tear gas grenade that force troops to abandon buildings(the building .cost:450$(requieres hidden lab)

-Sharp shooter:an ex-cartel warrior armed with a SVD marksman rifle,that kill most infantery in 2-3 shots at long range.they are hidden while not moving or shooting.cost:475$ (requieres hidden lab)

-Jungle ranger:profesional soldiers armed for jungle warfare.armed with lmgs.can throw white phosporus grenades that kill infanteryCost:575$ (requieres  stock exchange)


Factory:
-llama: a basic transport that have a capacity of 4soldiers.can be upgraded with a small crane that reapir vehicles cost:650 crane cost:200$

-EE-25 cascabel:an armour car armed with a tank gun.serve has a mbt in early stages.cost:850$

-parrot:a military truck that carry a anti air defence .the anti air are four short range missiles and one single autocanon.cost:600

-coyote;SAP anti infantery and anti garrison tank. it is armed with four machine guns that kills infantery fast.they also have a mortar that degarrison(only used in this cases)cost :800 $ requieres-hidden lab

Bms-3:a heavily armour infantery transport with 10 seats with fire ports.the first infantery will occupy a turret with an auto cannon.cost:1300$ requieres hidden lab and doctrine

Python:a missile based anti tank vehicles.can be improved each with an at cannoncost :1000$ requieres secret lab &doctrine.cannon upgraded cost:450

Thunder heavy anti air:the heavy AA vehicle of SAP.it is a six wheel vehicle armed with two HE missiles.faster than others but less damage.cost:1400$

Black panther:a whelled artillery armed with a burst cannon.shoot three shells in a wide area.long reload.cost:1200$

Jaguar:a heavy tank with camo,while immovile is hidden.can be upgrade with a 2 shell burst cannon.cost:1700

Air field:
Parrot:a dive bomber anti tank plane.drop two bombs,effective against tanks cost:1000$

Aguila dorada:a figther/bomber that requiere micro.switch between 4 autocannons and one anti structure missile.cost:1300 $

Visionario:a ligth scout helicopter.have two missiles ,can become stacionary and deploy sensors to detect sthealed units cost:850 $

Upgrades:
Solid slugs:add a second attack for militias,more range but slower firerate
Improved cannon:more damage for cascabel tank
Motivation camapain:all infantery are 10% faster
Improved missiles: better damage for home defenders
Autoloader:jaguar shoot two shots in a row
Double system:aguila dorada doesn't requiere to be manually switch
Faster engines:vehicles move even more faster
Long time inversion:you lost 5000$,You get 10000$ in two minutes(can be use more than one time)

[Knossos]

I was suddenly inclined to share this.

General Victoria "Athena" O'Shelly
Nation: USA
Branch: NORAD (North American Aerospace Defense Command) and National Guardsmen

Named after the protector and patron of Athens, she is a half-Irish/half-Greek woman who believes that the life of every soldier she commands must be protected. So, instead of having normal USA weaponry, she instead boasts a very large array of base defenses that could even outmatch the famed General Wilhelm of ECA. Based at Cheyenne Mountain, she believes that she could hold out against any enemy, wait for them to tire out, and send her elite units to destroy her opponent's base; that, or send them all to hell with her special superweaponry.

GENERAL POWERS:
-Has no Spectre, A-10 is replaced by Kinetic Bombardment. Satellite scan has a faster reload time.

-Kinetic Bombardment - Using USA's monstrous satellites at space, she could call on a kinetic bombardment of inert tungsten projectiles. Nothing fancy, just 1/2/3 sticks of death raining down upon the enemy, depending on the level.

Special Units/Structures/upgrade

-Has no Crusaders, Humvees, SEALs, Rangers are replaced by Guardsmen, Missile Defenders are replaced by Missile Guardsmen, no Paladins, but has complete usage of drones and air force. Firebase guided upgrade is automatically available to her.

-Athena Defense Cannon - A replacement of the Protector, the Athena is actually nothing more than a revision of General Towne's old Laser Turrets. They now consume less power, has a faster reload time and has farther range due to more sophisticated laser lensing technology. Although it has since lost the ability to detect hidden enemies, it is still a feared defense.

-AEGIS Platform - Originally a sea-based radar, General Victoria converted these old radars to detection and surveillance uses. Using very powerful phased array radar, it could see far well beyond any unit and structure. Caution must be used by using this, though; placing infantry near the radar could mean instantaneous death to them, due to the power radiated.

-M50 Ontos - A Vietnam-war Era vehicle, it was nevertheless an effective weapon system. Its design freshly broken out from the museum, it packs a large array of 4 recoilless Carl Gustavs and a coaxial machine gun, making it is bad news for any infantry, light or medium tank, and in mass numbers, even heavy tanks like the feared Sentinel and Golem. Although its armor is extremely lacking, its range and firepower is still top-notch.

-MSL MK.II - The RIM-67 Standard Missile was a very long-range missile of the 20th century era. Now converted to land use, it is the dedicated anti-air vehicle of General Victoria. Now christened as Mobile Standard Launcher Mark II, it has a capability comparable to the Chaparral, but boasts longer range and more damage per missile (it could theoretically bring down the large Propaganda Airship with one missile, some people say), but since the missile itself is so large, the vehicle must deploy in order to fire, and the vehicle could only carry three missiles at a time.

-Guardsmen and Missile Guardsmen - Civilians during peacetime, these men were called to "possible active service" as a precaution if Russia decides to invade Mainland U.S. Armed with M16s and Dragon Missile launchers, they are less effective against the active service men, but are cheaper due to the conscription involved.

-Titanium Armor Upgrade - Up-armors every building General Victoria has by 50%. They said that the NORAD complex was protected by Cheyenne Mountain, but it seems that the titanium armor of NORAD actually protects Cheyenne Mountain.

-Advanced Nanotechnology - Although not as sophisticated as those found on ECA's Manticore, U.S. does lead the world in the field of nanotechnology, and General Victoria has one ingenious way of putting it to her service; the so-called "construction drones" used in the infrastructure projects in U.S. has been modified in her care to be tank repair drones. Although not yet tested in service as the Manticore's has been, it holds much promise.

[SpiralSpectre]

I suddenly feel like making rough ideas for __CrUsHeR and Pepo's SAP faction. For me SAP is like US's "local-global competitor", the same as Russia and ECA are for each other. US and China are too geographically isolated to bring the proper theme... anyways :

1. Rockets and area denial : Focuses on building well equipped and cleverly tinkered army of anti-tank and anti-aircraft units to face US's "superior" aircraft and tanks. Kind of has a "beast killer" or "David vs. Goliath" theme. Recycling effects enemy vehicles as well as your own. Late-game research enables rockets to become almost immune to anti-rocket tech like Countermeasures and ECM, making them far more versatile and effective. In order to combat the growing drone threat has modified the Weather Control effects to shut down enemy vehicles and base power in addition to the usual effects. Has unique Ant Buggy variant with more mines and unique heavy AA.

Pros - Powerful hard counters, effective Weather Control, gains from enemy loses as well as your own.

cons - Less emphasis on Rapid Assault and Renewable Energy.

2. Black Contracts : Contracts with Favela and Cartel members to deploy stealthy assault infantry and strengthens SAP's already formidable income sources. These officially "civilian reinforcements" enable deployment of stealthy mobile supply collectors. Supply Collector Vans are replaced with faster and armed Technical-esque vehicles. Has unique stealthy infantry replacing several vanilla infantry which are geared for rapid assault and jungle warfare. Your infantry's enthusiasm for pillaging mean you gain money for every enemy building you capture. Infantry can be armed with methane based weapons (based on the gen power), can use stimulus to temporarily increase combat efficiency (very effective after the global upgrades that improve infantry stats). Gets better transports like all infantry based sub-factions.

Pros - powerful logistics and income, rapid assault, active camouflage.

cons - somewhat weaker in the weather control and bio-fuel department, costly infantry, micro intensive.

3. Total Commitment : The steamroller of the SAP forces. focuses on their direct warfare strengths to meet more sophisticated enemies head on. Uses more robust and effective sources of bio-diesels to power up fast and cheap. More efficient ore related buildings for quick, direct cash flow. Has better MBT and artillery. No spectacular strength but has no harsh weakness either.

Pros - better direct assault, fast and flexible army, while the income might be lower than other SAP factions it's direct and requires less attention, less micro intensive.

Cons - somewhat lacks in the stealth department.

[Knjaz.]

We shouldn't given them an ROF bonus, because with the Pandora it could be abused badly, in just the same way for the Russians it coupled with the Air Raid Sirens and Grumbles and you would have automatic Grumble AA. No...Just no....no....ok....no....

I can also envisage nasty Tesla towers and/or automatic Sentinels and things. At lease with the ECA they have build limits on their 'uber units' which helps avoid that issue.

There're no Teslas for that general. And overpriced Sents & Grumbles, but the complain is rather valid. 10% ROF could be a better choice, if it's available from the start. And yes, I'd actually support such an "aura" for current ECA. At least for either Royal Guard and/or mechanized warfare generals.
10% ROF is hard to abuse.

Also, higher ROF doesnt make grumbles that much better.

In general I like your take on a 'reservist' general, however I'm not sure if the balance might be a bit wonky, you have Conscripts being produced 'in twos', yet Russia is nowhere near the population powerhouse that China is IRL or in the ROTR Universe, also just because its still a conscription based military doesn't mean that we should be giving them mega infantry buffs since Russia is quite a bit more of the 'Tracktion Fist' mega mania and less the 'Infantry Wave' which we might give to China, doing the whole 1950s thing.

Double conscripts are there only to symbolize that he can produce/field more stuff simultaneously, not that his manpower is higher. (his armored reserves are definitely higher, though) By building 2 instead of one, player would get no advantage in either cost or build speed. If it takes (fictional numbers) 6 seconds and 100$ to build 1 conscript, that Nikolai would be building 2 conscripts in 12 seconds and 200$. I'd even say thats a disadvantage, at start.

Likewise 'mobilising' I like that idea a fair bit, like the cash bounty, have multiple levels (~3) of 'mass production upgrade' that decrease the time per unit perhaps. However the thing we don't want to do is turn Russia into 'spammy spammy semi-uber, with chinesy crappyness tagged on'. No while I think an economic bonus is a very nice them representing (re)industrialisation of Russia and its eastern regions, I don't think giving the Chinese model for this is the right way to do it.

Reserve forces and mobilized versions of equipment are always sub-par compared to the first line troops, but are much more numerous. That's the whole point of this general.
And it's not directly comparable to China - When playing China, you make alot of cheap stuff at start, with more expensive stuff later. With that one, you make expensive stuff at start, with cheaper stuff later.

In terms of the Tunguska / Sheilka they are fairly self similar, just that the Tunguska has missiles attached creating a new model for the same thing in effect might be OTT, likewise there is a lot of artillery units in that generals outlay! 3 Special ones, sure they might fit/replace the Mista and TOS, but it looks again fairly Zhukov and while I know the Russians are artillery nuts for the most part....that's still a lot of guns...

Shilka is there only to be "in line" with reserve/refurbished units. I guess there'd be almost no difference between it and the Mobilized version of Tunguska I proposed.

As for alot of arty, it's honestly something I forgot to do - remove TOS-1. Fixed now. Yes, he doesn't have a garrison clearing unit, with exception of RPG trooper. (well, could've thrown a BMPT here, but it wouldn't fit him, at all) As for that 122mm arty, it's there only to exist as a separate weaker arty unit that you can get for free - a replacement for BRDMs which I'm not that big fan of. It'd be weaker than those 152mm/203mm SPGs, definitely.

Such amount of arty is also required due to his sub-par ground force. While it has the numbers, it won't have the firepower of it's Chinese counterpart, and his air (as originally intended) would be greatly limited due to lack of MassProd.

. I also like the suggestion of arming the MTP and giving it conscripts 'ready to go' for repaired vehicles (that was my notion with giving the Commissar additional Conscripts for free, but that was also partly for theme), since it brings about a whole notion of 'units that can operate together on their own away from anywhere important' which if you are going to stick your reserves anywhere in Russia it well beyond the frontlines where it is out of reach totally.

Main idea is to have an armored "combat" version of MTP with much better survivability and, as a bonus, with pair of conscripts in it - and to make it fit the looks of russian ground forces. Machine-gun is there just for giggles. It should be kinda weak. (definitely not stronger than supply truck MG, prolly weaker)

What I do like is the notion of giving MiGs for the Reserve airforce, this is a good idea (replace both aircraft with duel purpose MiGs slightly better than the Chinese ones due to missile tech...?)

Well, those Aircraft were there just as an example of how it could look like. Original idea was to leave his air as it was - but without mass production upgrade, it'd always be an expensive one, as intended. But I've thrown older equipment there just for the sake of it - to make this general look like something as different from "vanilla" Russia, as Salvage general was different from rest of GLA in SHW.

I think however the emergency repair radius is good at its current size it might be a bit OP to make it massive, and render MTPs potentially less useful, which if the notion is to give a flavour unit, you want it to be at the heart of the matter.

With all those losses this general will be taking, not sure in that. You'll literally have your tanks blowing up left and right. A longer, 5 minute cooldown can help with that.

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 18 Jun 2013, 18:35

[Nemanja]

Was thinking along the lines of yours and Re_Simeone , then I thought;

“You know old chap, Polish resistance in WWII and all that lot with code breaking and general awesomeness, what we need is some good old Polish Partisans armed with Molotov Cocktails, booby traps and all manner of sabotage nastyness to screw over anybody.

...And old bean that is exactly where the shelter notion could come in, let partisand be able to 'build' a little 'OP for themselves' somewhere between guard tower 'I see you' and just stealthing up, or possibly just as a stealth and really weak version of the ECA fortification. Through in Molotovs effective at close range at tanks and you have a good ambush unit....

...While thinking on the same score, while giving the ECA a sniper might be horribly OP, a marksman with generally longer range and a 'might miss with rifle' type weapon code* and perhaps you might have something for keeping the infantry's heads down, best balenced so several have to be deployed to be effective with them missing more often than not...

...Then throw in the Czech shoot and scoot wheeled artillery (something like the 152mm DANA SpGH) as a Tier 1 artillery unit which fires 'en barrage' and is effective vs tanks and vehicles rather than infantry, and you are starting to build up a good force for the eastern resistance and vanguard which take the brunt of the Russian advance before the Germans get into battle...�


So Picking the best ideas and trying to combine them...good points...will muse on ideas...

I thought little bit more about ECA resistance General,especially his tactics and how they would work out in Zero Hour setting.
I intended to post it but then dozen of Polish general posts came out so I decided to step back.

But now I thought little bit more about it,and I'll post as soon as I can,and I'll try to put some sketches of how that things would work.

[X1Destroy]

Things are getting more amazing here, you guys sure have alots of brilliant ideas

I think I will save this topic somewhere else, in case we're lacking idea for ours own mod, if it would ever be made

[MARS]

One thing I'd also find interesting - albeit somewhat inappropriate for the setting - would be a USA High-Tech/Black Project General whose arsenal would be heavily inspired by the various technologies of the Metal Gear universe, but that'd be more appropriate for that 'imaginary RTS' in described in the other thread, which wouldn't be bound by the conventions of the ROTR-verse.

[Mcbob]

One thing I'd also find interesting - albeit somewhat inappropriate for the setting - would be a USA High-Tech/Black Project General whose arsenal would be heavily inspired by the various technologies of the Metal Gear universe, but that'd be more appropriate for that 'imaginary RTS' in described in the other thread, which wouldn't be bound by the conventions of the ROTR-verse.

High Tech Special Forces Unit Foxhound. Replacing Burton as a group of unique hero units. I'd dig that a lot.