1.86 Unofficial Knjaz's "Light" patch., 1.0 Released.|| This is NOT an RGO patch! Options

[Knjaz.]

Installation: Put the !!!!Knjaz's Light Patch.big file into folder where Rise of the Reds 1.86 is installed.
Uninstall: remove !!!!Knjaz's Light Patch.big file from the folder where Rise of the Reds 1.86 is installed.
Changelog inside the archive, in README .doc file.

What this patch does and what it doesn't: This patch is meant to address certain critical balance issues and bugs/glitches/ini mistakes of the 1.86 RotR version. The original idea was to keep amount of changes to a minimum, and as such it's not meant to fix certain issues entirely, because it'd require a much deeper rework than this patch is intended to do.
On the other hand, it follows general development policies of RotR and tries to avoid decisions that would be outright impossible in official version, and as such it doesn't deviate from current gameplay. There are some exceptions to that rule, most noticeable one is Manticore's stealth detection. Consider it a crutch of sorts, until RotR 2.0 gets released.

This patch is meant for those who prefer 1.86 gameplay with some basic fixes.*

As of now, it should be safe to use on SWRNet, as it doesn't change any files that are forbidden to change.Special thanks go to GeneralCamo for the (re-)implementation of Fire Support GPs , as well as fixing ranger infantry capture bugs. Credits to our community for all provided feedback, to XAttus for helping me to test several things, and if I accidentally forgot someone who directly participated in this, kick me in the head.

*Currently I'm making another one, rather different "patch", where I'm not restraining myself by what is and what is not possible in official RotR development, and only concentrate on the gameplay, faction themes and existing issues, as well as testing out certain ideas and concepts. As of now it's only available to members of public RotR Skype group.

External download mirrors:
DropBox Download Link.
MediaFire Download Link.

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 20 Jan 2016, 11:39

Attached File(s)

 Knjaz_s_Light_Patch_for_RotR186.rar ( 1.11MB ) Number of downloads: 53

 

[TimeBurner]

Glory to Knjaz! I'm gonna sacrifice a kitten now!

[Skitt]

Removed this comment due to it being outdated.

This post has been edited by mr_Skittles: 6 Jan 2016, 10:26

[Zion]

This is not a complaint.. so don't get me wrong..
Im just wondering if this actually helps or breaks things..

That's a pretty big health nerf to the migs, who snipes what T1 huh? so does this mean I need 3 migs to take out avenger? cuz I lose one?

I haven't tested that's why I'm asking, and I probably won't be able to test in a while.

2 main reasons for mig rush,.... humvees and buggies.... thats cuz china has a tough time with anything fast.. Yes people are complaining,, but how many of them actually played china and realized how mig dependent it is? So now that GLA has stingers, and USA has fast avengers... with this health nerf,, any t1 aa spam with lock down china's sniping ability... .? not to mention russia's untouchable AA... now I am forced to suicide migs.. 1000 bucks is not a cheap suicide.. 2 grand suicide to take out key units...
..
so t2 mig armor upgrade. which now is mainly for the hans and ships and by t2 certain factions deny china air completely.. and not to mention easy airfield snipes anyways...

the mig is one of those key units that need to be countered from experience... just cuz this thing snipes things when you dont pay enough attention is not a good reason (i think to decrease heath) every faction has those hard to counter units...

Edit: Put the mig armor upgrade in prop center maybe?

This post has been edited by Zion: 14 Dec 2015, 17:32

[TimeBurner]

2 main reasons for mig rush,.... humvees and buggies.... thats cuz china has a tough time with anything fast.. Yes people are complaining,, but how many of them actually played china and realized how mig dependent it is?

China has problem with fast mobile units? Mines and hoppers,mines and hoppers. But,that's my opinion. dont take it so hard,cause it's not a dick.

Also,migs are very fast sniping units, used together with china's map visibility, which is extensively good, they can survive most suicide attacks with a red health bar.

This post has been edited by TimeBurner: 14 Dec 2015, 17:39

[Knjaz.]

This is not a complaint.. so don't get me wrong..
Im just wondering if this actually helps or breaks things..

That's a pretty big health nerf to the migs, who snipes what T1 huh? so does this mean I need 3 migs to take out avenger? cuz I lose one?

I haven't tested that's why I'm asking, and I probably won't be able to test in a while.

2 main reasons for mig rush,.... humvees and buggies.... thats cuz china has a tough time with anything fast.. Yes people are complaining,, but how many of them actually played china and realized how mig dependent it is? So now that GLA has stingers, and USA has fast avengers... with this health nerf,, any t1 aa spam with lock down china's sniping ability... .? not to mention russia's untouchable AA... now I am forced to suicide migs.. 1000 bucks is not a cheap suicide.. 2 grand suicide to take out key units...
..
so t2 mig armor upgrade. which now is mainly for the hans and ships and by t2 certain factions deny china air completely.. and not to mention easy airfield snipes anyways...

the mig is one of those key units that need to be countered from experience... just cuz this thing snipes things when you dont pay enough attention is not a good reason (i think to decrease heath) every faction has those hard to counter units...

First of all, their anti-buggy performance isn't changed, unless opponent will keep Quads between your migs and his buggies, which measn you can catch those quads with ground force and kill em.

Second of all, if you're against grumble,s it doesn't matter if your MiG has 210 health or 250. (and hell it's not meant to have 250 health, no matter what. That was a bug). It'll be 2 hit kill anyway. But now, your MiGs have higher chance to kill Arena covered Mstas (because it takes 3 missiles to kill one), as well as it costs you less to lose migs, in the long run, due to cheaper price.

I'm pretty sure they'll be able to unload their payload on avengers, though I'm not sure why would you want them to, and not go for Humvees instead. You can now exchange MiGs for Humvees in 1:1 ratio in T1 cost-wise, if Humvees don't have any targeteers or battledrones on them, if they do, that costs oyu less than the humvee you just killed.

Hope that answers your concerns

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 14 Dec 2015, 17:37

[M.P]

now I am forced to suicide migs.. 1000 bucks is not a cheap suicide.. 2 grand suicide to take out key units...

Comparing to Hind suicide it's pretty cheap. So SU and go away

This post has been edited by Comrade M.P: 14 Dec 2015, 17:55

[Mizo]

Viechle digouts T1? Welp they're trash again. Like there is now really no point in using them anymore. ( someone explain me when will you use inferior defenses that cost more). Their only real selling point was for rushes, and now that's gone, I don't really see the appeal to them anymore. ( I might wanna test this, but yeah, thanks alot Bruce xD)

I have no problem with the harrier range nerf. This would make them easier to deal with for GLA without making them crap against other factions.
Tiger nerf is also warranted.

Claymore buffs <3

And now ECA officially has the shittiest sec eco in game.... goodie...

This post has been edited by Mizo: 14 Dec 2015, 18:54

[Knjaz.]

Viechle digouts T1? Welp they're trash again. Like there is now really no point in using them anymore. ( someone explain me when will you use inferior defenses that cost more). Their only real selling point was for rushes, and now that's gone, I don't really see the appeal to them anymore. ( I might wanna test this, but yeah, thanks alot Bruce xD)

I have no problem with the harrier range nerf. This would make them easier to deal with for GLA without making them crap against other factions.
Tiger nerf is also warranted.

Claymore buffs <3

And now ECA officially has the shittiest sec eco in game.... goodie...

As you could see in changelog comments about TelecomTower income change was a crutch I did since bashing ECA early game's offensive/harassment capabilities, compensating via removal Howitzer initial cooldown to help with artillery rush, etc, would go far outside of that patch's intentions to partially address most pressing issues. (the VDV/US paradrop change wasn't really needed in this sense of fixing critical stuff, but it's good to test it before proposing it for official one). I really don't like that decision as it goes against faction theme, but it was the quickest and cleanest I had with the ECA's current scaling through the game for this patch.

Digouts - they were broken vs US on T0, and they were rarely used vs everyone else, as I've mentioned it before. So yes, that is the cleanest solution. ECA shouldn't be able to put THAT much pressure on US early on while also having their massive advantages later on, since US is a faction with counterable artillery.

Which would result in digout nerf and would make it even more useless vs other factions in Tier 0 and later on. Hence I went with throwing them to Tier 1 without any changes.

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 14 Dec 2015, 19:25

[Mizo]

If you are talking about the digout rush, then try doing that on a 2v2 large map then see how broken it is.
Because aside from this, ECA can't really put any sort of pressure on USA, ( don't even mention gepards, by the time you get 2, USA is rolling with 4 humvees). True it's very potent against them on small maps IF done correctly, which still leaves your base open due to it being expensive.

The reason that am salty about this is that nobody freaken use them to begin with.... and now ECA is royally gonna get beaten by USA till late game if they even make it to that point. ( since USA will have complete free breathing space). Vlate game tomohawk spam with 4 AFs worth of NHs is gonna break ECA for sure and they have no real way to slow it down.

This post has been edited by Mizo: 14 Dec 2015, 19:47

[Knjaz.]

You're saying that US/ECA matchups rely entirely on the digout rush and it's effectiveness? I don't remember ECA being as screwed as you described before Digout rush became even a thing, which happened only several weeks ago, even after first draft of possible post-release changes was made, which happened some time after 1.86 release.

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 14 Dec 2015, 20:08

[Mizo]

Considering that early HK dozer snipes and blackhawk rushes are a thing now , along with constant raptor snipes and snowballs of humvees, crusaders and avengers then yes, digouts are quiet important. The ability to change your defense module + preventing your gepards, Leopards and maybe mortar trucks from getting sniped in addition to getting an early cheap Good AA is pretty essential, or atleast that's how I see it.

If ECA doesn't put any pressure against a faction then they are pretty screwed and you know it. They can apply pressure on all factions with the least affected being China and to an extent GLA ( but then again GLA needs to be up in your face to really do anything).

USA was the middle ground. If you did a proper gepard rush, then things will go well for you. If not then well prepare to be snowballed. Considering that USA's scouting got alot better, it's harder to find a hard spot for them to apply pressure via Sole Gepard rush because Humvees and vision. The digouts helped in preserving early gepard losses, which can happen pretty easily due to either towvees, HKs or heck even rangers.
With the digouts delayed, there is no longer any point whatsoever to go WF anymore, atleast not ad an openning, since everything will get sniped if they are not in base, meaning that any sort of retaliation is not really viable due to jet/humvee spam snipes. Gepard rush is not what it used to be anymore due to all the nerf it got.

Then again, I might be blowing this out of propotion. Fighting Rik's/Bruce's/Comp's USA really does that to you though. Only way I managed to stay alive using a WF openning is protecting my tanks in digouts and now that it's been delayed, it's gonna get downhill from there. There is no point in getting the digouts now whatsoever.

I either have to turtle as hard as I can or just loose the game.

This post has been edited by Mizo: 14 Dec 2015, 20:47

[Zion]

China has problem with fast mobile units? Mines and hoppers,mines and hoppers. But,that's my opinion. dont take it so hard,cause it's not a dick.

Also,migs are very fast sniping units, used together with china's map visibility, which is extensively good, they can survive most suicide attacks with a red health bar.

Comparing to Hind suicide it's pretty cheap. So SU and go away

I like how these assholes/"homos" still show up on every one of my posts.. its kinda hilarious.. as if someone hired them. or maybe its their hobby.. hmm i have better hobbies. xD
(where does a "penis" come into play here TB?)
and no buddy hoppers don't work. especially when you chose the com intercept GP xD Mines?... lol its not eca here pal
MP if you suicide your hinds, your doing something wrong haha

Apart from that, Thanks for clarifying some things knjaz. and I go for avengers sometimes.. so that I can snipe AA and bring in the hans..
Ill have to play some games first.. just wanted a little more detail on this that's all

[GeneralCamo]

Ad Hominem attacks do not make you look smarter. Stop using them.

I want to emphasize that my support does not show any "official" support from SWR. I'm just happy to help a person with their project. That said, Doomhammer's streams are unlikely to use this patch, so make sure to remove this when you want to play on his stream.

[{Lads}RikerZZZ]

Kj, ya done good. I was super worried you were gonna screw everything up with some of the changes you proposed, but what you've presented are good fair and balanced changes that we needed. Good work mate.

Still, one thing worries me. The vee exp changes. Is that a nurf or a buff?

[Knjaz.]

Well, explained it to you in skype already, might as well leave it here for others - those "other changes" are for entirely different "patch", which would be called Gameplay Overhaul/Rebalance Mod, and would have little relation to this one.

It's where I won't be restraining myself by official development policies and impossibility of certain things in official rotr development, and will focus on following faction themes + gameplay + balance only, even if it'd take something as radical as axing mobile Topols from the game, or throwing them to Rank 5, or reforging GLA T0 (this is the one that freaked you out, I guess?) Will also use it as a testing grounds for certain ideas, like the said GLA T0.

There will definitely be 1 more update to this patch, where raising issues with the changes made (which I bet there will be) will get addressed.

This post has been edited by Knjaz.: 14 Dec 2015, 22:34

[rey]

So far, I'm only leaving this for the registered forum users, since I have confidence that our pvp community here knows what it is doing when copying files around, hence no external download link - for now.

looking forward to that.! 8)

-Vehicle Digouts require Solar Reactor.
-Harriers and Claymores are now part of “Fire Support” unlock.

these 2 changes made me think of a long ago appearing questions: why Digouts need unlock, and why would i use them if have Fortifications and Gun turrets from the start? for some reason i always thought it's something wrong with Fortification upgrade(to protect infantry from clearing weapons) and Digouts need unlocks, while Gun turret if here and doing it well. just thoughts.

[BliTTzZ]

If you are talking about the digout rush, then try doing that on a 2v2 large map then see how broken it is.
Because aside from this, ECA can't really put any sort of pressure on USA, ( don't even mention gepards, by the time you get 2, USA is rolling with 4 humvees). True it's very potent against them on small maps IF done correctly, which still leaves your base open due to it being expensive.

We're creating 1v1 match-up balance first of all. And no, you can't get 4 humvees with USA when ECA only has 2 Gepards. Check your facts:
1). Humvees and Gepards both need 10 seconds to be built;
2). USA and ECA WF/Supply Center need 10 seconds to be built;
3). ECA doesn't have a powerplant in it's buildorder, so there's also 10 seconds less in total.
To summarize: when USA gets 3 Humvees, ECA already has 4 Gepards.

Considering that early HK dozer snipes and blackhawk rushes are a thing now , along with constant raptor snipes and snowballs of humvees, crusaders and avengers then yes, digouts are quiet important. The ability to change your defense module + preventing your gepards, Leopards and maybe mortar trucks from getting sniped in addition to getting an early cheap Good AA is pretty essential, or atleast that's how I see it.
If ECA doesn't put any pressure against a faction then they are pretty screwed and you know it. They can apply pressure on all factions with the least affected being China and to an extent GLA ( but then again GLA needs to be up in your face to really do anything).

ECA is not supposed to effectively harass the faction which excels in the early game agression. And airfield opening doesn't work against ECA with WF first because when you have your first Bhawk/HK there's already one Gepard near your supply, shooting down your Ospreys. Infantry don't work well against them due to anti-infantry grenades and manned machinegun

Kj, ya done good. I was super worried you were gonna screw everything up with some of the changes you proposed, but what you've presented are good fair and balanced changes that we needed. Good work mate.

Still, one thing worries me. The vee exp changes. Is that a nurf or a buff?

Vee
0 - 60 - 120 - 240 (experience required for veterancy)
30 - 30 - 50 - 100 (experience reward for destroying it)

BMP/Lynx
0 - 100 - 200 - 300 (experience required for veterancy)
50 - 50 - 100 - 150 (experience reward for destroying it)

So, considering Vees were placed on the BMP/Lynx level it's clearly a nerf.

This post has been edited by BliTTzZ: 14 Dec 2015, 22:57

[TimeBurner]

I like how these assholes/"homos" still show up on every one of my posts.. its kinda hilarious.. as if someone hired them. or maybe its their hobby.. hmm i have better hobbies. xD
(where does a "penis" come into play here TB?)
and no buddy hoppers don't work. especially when you chose the com intercept GP xD Mines?... lol its not eca here pal
MP if you suicide your hinds, your doing something wrong haha

Apart from that, Thanks for clarifying some things knjaz. and I go for avengers sometimes.. so that I can snipe AA and bring in the hans..
Ill have to play some games first.. just wanted a little more detail on this that's all

I told you not to take it too hard.

There are so many things China can do. Mines doesnt work? Are they harrasing/rushing your lawn or something? Redguards,battlemasters,gattling tanks,this units are fast enough to bait and attack any rush. If any faction is the most rush resistant,it's china. It has fast mobile units that can be spammed right away.

[Mizo]

@Blitzz....point taken, I was defintely blowing this out of propotion considering that I might be the only one in the comminity to actually use the digouts and make them work consistently. I need to do somw testing and adapt new strats around them then .

By the way are some of the bugs fixex? Talking about the rangers not spawning from a destroyed strat center or the pioneer AT mines not working properly... ( I really need the latter fixed, to do some further testing on how effective pioneer mining is)

[Skitt]

drop zone is fixed and so is the hk stealth bug.
knjaz forgot about the rangers and im guessing the pioneres as well

[XCABAL]

@Blitzz....point taken, I was defintely blowing this out of propotion considering that I might be the only one in the comminity to actually use the digouts and make them work consistently. I need to do somw testing and adapt new strats around them then .

By the way are some of the bugs fixex? Talking about the rangers not spawning from a destroyed strat center or the pioneer AT mines not working properly... ( I really need the latter fixed, to do some further testing on how effective pioneer mining is)

Actually I also used them. I don't play MP often but I used 'em in a similar role.

[XAOC-RU-]

GLOBAL:
-US Rangers can capture infantry on Tier 0. (GeneralCamo)
-InfernoCannon firestorm initiation formula optimized to prevent 2 infernos from being able to start firestorm upon receiving basic horde bonus. You can still do it, but it requires both bonuses in upgraded state, as well as simultaneous shots – 0.5 second difference will already be too much and prevent you from starting a firestorm.
-Informants properly reveal themselves when next to objects.
-HeavyArtilleryArmor FLAME from 100% to 50%. (we don’t want Hellions to burn new Claymores to the ground with single barrage, and then taking on another one with main weaponry).
-VDV and US Paradrops now drop vehicles first, infantry second.


ECA

-Claymore health changed from 600 to 400.
-Claymore speed increase from 20 to 24, SpeedDamaged from 18 to 22.
-Claymore turn rate increase from 50 to 60.
-Claymore Acceleration Damaged from 8 to 12.
-Telecom Tower DepositTiming from 2750 to 2900 – This is an alternative to nerfing early/mid game of the ECA, which would require bigger changes than I’m willing to implement in this patch. More of a crutch, than a solution, and would unlikely to be used later on.
-Satellite Uplink cost from 1500$ to 2500$.
-Satellite Uplink build time from 30 to 60.

-Mechanized Batallion requires Warfactory.
-Vehicle Digouts require Solar Reactor.
-Mortar Track Battlenetwork range increase from 700 to 760.
-Lynxes require Warfactory to be built in Field Command.
-Tiger locomotor switched from ComancheLocomotor to TigerLocomotor.
-Harrier range reduction from 400 to 350. You’re no Raptor, my friend. (even HKs and Raptors are at 380, Sokols and MiGs sit at 350).
-AnvilBotNanoBotLocomotor Speed and Acceleration from 15 to 18.
-Manticore reveals all stealth objects within 250 range. (TroopCrawler/SentryDrone equivalent).

-Harriers and Claymores are now part of “Fire Support” unlock.
-Fire Support unlock replaces Ammunition Stockpiles, Ammunition Stockpiles go to Prepared Defences. Harriers are way too good for Tier 1 with their current stats outside of Charles. So instead of applying nerfs (which I did apply in the end, since their range is ridiculous), common opinion is that giving ECA at least 1 unit unlock is required, especially since ECA has no unlockable general-unique units whatsoever, unlike everyone else – everything is available by default.

Russia:

-Golem price rollback from 2000 to 1800. They weren’t that good but had a niche in 1.802, then they got Shtora and became good, then they got machineguns and became broken while also one out of 2 their previous roles, then they got nerfed and their primary role of good cost/survivability ratio nerfed with it. Hence rolling back price change and hitting the AA capabilities instead.
-Golem AA machinegun damage from 6.5 to 4.5, 31% reduction. Anti-ground MG was already nerfed enough, if not enough – let me know.
-Sokol StealthDelay from 1.000 to 1.500. This is needed to compensate for the decisions taken to improve their anti-missile survivability via general hp buff.
-Topol Health/Survivability stats equalized with that of Claymore.
-Msta health change from 250 to 240. (allows 3 MiG missiles to snipe it or full Harrier burst, relevant.)
-VDV Paratrooper Machinegun DelayBetweenShots from 0.070 seconds to 0.060 seconds.
-MTP Recovery ability cooldown increased from 10 to 20 seconds.
-Kodiak experience value from 150 to 100.
-Kodiak damage from 80 to 85. Fallen way behind after all the price/health increases, should help Russia in tank combat on T0. Meant to address Russia/GLA T0 issue.
-Hellion braking speed changed from 60 to 45.


China

-MiG Fighter base health from 160 to 120, as according to August 2014 changelog. So it is 120/210 now, instead of 160/250. Which should fix the T1 snipes people been complaining about for eternity….
-MiG Fighter cost from 1100$ to 1000$. …while also making them more expendable later on.

GLA
-GPS Scrambler/Van disabling ability is disabled.
-Scorpion health reduction from 370 to 340. Meant to primarily address Russia/GLA T0 issue.
-Chemical Lab build time from 45 to 40. (Real – from 56 to 50 seconds).


USA
-Ranger Experience Values equalized with Felins and Green Berets.
-Humvee price increase from 600 to 700.
-Humvee ExperienceGain and ExperienceValue equalized with those of Lynx and BMP.
-TOW price decrease from 400 to 300.
-Sentry drone price from 650 to 550. They lost the godlike ping, after all.
-CIA Priority Report from 3000$ to 2500$.
-Starlifter Speed increased from 85 to 100, SpeedDamaged from 60 to 80.
-BlackHawk range from 240 to 220. Because changing their locomotor is not an option, screws over combat drop.

Ok thats my opinion. Increasing Kodiak's main gun damage will not help much against GLA because they are too slow and expensive. Its much better to use BMP with infantry on T0 against GLA. Kodiaks are good but only when you have stable eco income but no normal GLA player will just sit and watch how your army grows. He will permanently attacking your supplies. And what unit will def it? I think not kodiak. My opinion is buff BMP main gun or its movement speed parameters.
Nerfing Scorpions HP? Well maybe he's too good for his price do not really know?
Do not really understand about Hellions breaking speed changes. Is that mean that he will break more slowly and in fact he becomes more easy to be shoting down?
-Topol Health/Survivability stats equalized with that of Claymore. So thats mean Topol have only 400 HP like Claymore? Isn't it too small ammount? I mean Claymore's price is 2500. But topol have ICBM. so it's price is much higher. And you want to snipe it easily?
About ECA nerf. Is Satelink is broken? And that nefr with digouts. They was rarely used before buff. But now? I agree with Mizo and now they become useless. I agree only with harrier nerf. Good USA changes especcially humvees
And for global changes. I think sell time for all buildings might be increase +1-2 seconds.

This post has been edited by XAOC-RU-: 15 Dec 2015, 19:38

[Mizo]

Xaoc-Ru , Topols aren't really the essential asset that Russia needs to break ECA. They are a luxury unit, super powerful to the point it breaks the faction ( ECA). Unlike claymores, they already pay their price once they fire one missile. Keep in mind that if it was killed while arming/armed its missile, you get refunded the cost of the missile. The HP nerf is to give some counterability from ECA, because frankly they can't be countered.

As for viechle digouts, nobody used them but me in real PvP but knjaz and I managed to find a broken strat vs USA in 1v1s, that I tended to (ab)use against Bruce to test it actually works against the best, and it did. Making them T1 is the cleanest nerf I guess.

Satalite Uplink was fucking broken. Every 3 minutes you get a free map hack that lasted 15 seconds without the cost of a GP. Old ECA needed to invest 4.5k to get this ability, and now you get it for 1.5k, that's too much.

[XCABAL]

I thought the point of having a slower building slightly more expensive lynx transport was to give you a transport for field command openings. Why would I want to make one at a field command now since I can get one faster and cheaper from the WF I am forced to build?